Ruairi Moynihan: Lessons from failing to qualify for the olympic marathon trials

Cory Nagler [00:00:00]: I know you had really high hopes. It sounds like training was going well. So when you do cross that finish line, what are some of the first thoughts going through your head?

Coach Ruiari [00:00:10]: Oh, disappointment. I had a a good cry. I haven't had a a nice cry after a race for a while just acknowledging all the time I put in. And, I don't know how useful it is, but it could just be a good release to let yourself be sad about it for a while.

Cory Nagler [00:00:27]: That was RC coach Rory Moynihan, a 2/21 marathoner who recently completed the California International marathon in hopes of achieving his goal of hitting the Two eighteen Olympic trials qualifying time. We're joined on the show by Rory and his coach, Dylan Bellas, to discuss training to prepare for this goal And ultimately falling just short as well as what other runners chasing ambitious goals can learn from this experience. During the interview, We'll discuss some lighthearted and more serious topics, including why the Olympic trials was an important goal for Rory, why Rory and Dylan were confident an OTQ time was achievable, Why the camaraderie between Rory and Dylan makes them an even better team? And thoughts on how runners can bounce back from a disappointing performance? Hello, runners, and welcome to the run to the top podcast, where our goal is making you a better runner with each and every episode. I'm your showrunner, Corey Nagler, And I'm not an only runner, but together, we'll explore new strategies and topics to take your running to the next level. This podcast is created produced by the expert team of coaches at runnersconnect.net, where you can find the best running information on the Internet as well as training plans to fit every runner and every budget. Welcome back, RC. I have with me today our very own coach, Rory Moynihan, and his personal coach, Dylan Bellas. Welcome to the show, each of you.

Coach Ruiari [00:01:55]: Hey. Thanks for having us, Corey.

Dylan Belles [00:01:57]: Absolutely. Happy to be here.

Cory Nagler [00:02:00]: Absolutely. And excited to have you both. Dylan, you actually used to be a coach with RC yourself. Is that right? That is correct. That's awesome. Well, so excited to have you both with me today. But really, our story today is, Rory, your experience in your chase for the OTQ time. For those who are not familiar, this is the Olympic Trials Qualifier, which is coming up in February in Orlando.

Cory Nagler [00:02:25]: So let's start with Rory. Why was it an important goal for you to OTQ? And what are your thoughts on just coming short of that goal?

Coach Ruiari [00:02:36]: Hey. Let's get into it. I'd say first of all, just so people can kinda correlate it to something, It would probably be my version of the Boston qualifying time just with regards to the honor, prestige, and then just Obviously, a little bit of an elevated element where you're representing your country. You know, technically, everyone on that start line has a Legitimate shot to make the Olympic team. You never know what can happen. Chances are slim that I would ever do it, but it it's just something that I kinda heard about through pride YouTube videos, running blogs, maybe back in 2017 when I was still living in Phoenix, Arizona. I As a full time teacher, cross country coach, I knew of Flagstaff and how it was a big running hub for pros, And I had this inkling to to move, up to Flagstaff, so I ended up doing that in 2018. And, at that point, I had already qualified for the Boston marathon in my debut marathon at Grandma's in 2017, And I'd run the Mesa marathon, and then I did that epic, 2018, Boston, race, which was just obviously terrible weather.

Coach Ruiari [00:03:50]: And while it was a fun accomplishment, it just didn't satisfy that, You know, feeling that I'd run my best or fastest time. So since I'd already gotten there, you know, what some people consider the, Epitome of marathon running. I'm like, what's the a reasonable challenge for me? And for that for me, that was the o t q.

Cory Nagler [00:04:12]: Absolutely. Yeah. And I should take a step back here. The Olympic trials qualifier, Rory, recently ran at the California International Marathon, An attempt to qualify, and it is incredibly difficult to make it. And I know this is something you've been working towards, Rory, for a very long time. So you touched on some of the races leading up to it. What kinda went into trying to make that qualifier Or is part of this goal leading off to that, that Boston qualifier you alluded to? And then kind of what are your thoughts coming off of that race?

Coach Ruiari [00:04:49]: Oh, yeah. So I guess that's that's very early on in my, time line, so I'm not sure if you were asking about the the races this trading cycle or just early on, because I'm happy to talk about either.

Cory Nagler [00:05:02]: Yeah. I'm thinking more so kind of did we get from running Boston early on to wanting to run CIM so recently? And and what are your kind of thoughts Right. Now or feeling after that?

Coach Ruiari [00:05:12]: Well, with Dylan here, it would be I'd be remiss not to mention probably one of the, Biggest moments for me, defining moments was, like, attending Olympic trials in person in Atlanta in 2020 in February Right before, as everyone knows, COVID really took full effect, so we were still traveling normally. At that point, I'd been living with Dylan for A couple years. Also, we had a friend, Craig Hunt, who was living with us, and then, Dylan's girlfriend, now fiancee, moved in with him. And these runners were, all in the Olympic trials. So at one point, when we were all living together, these were Yeah. I could say, like, my roommates were in the Olympic trials. So I think the biggest thing for a runner is if you see friends and people you know accomplishing a goal, it makes seemed that more much more tangible, whereas where I was in Phoenix, it was just something I knew I wanted to do then seeing the energy and this, The pride runners felt and seeing all the families and loved ones, like, celebrating and cheering these runners on. I mean, it was like the Super Bowl, you know, next to Boston, it felt like the Super Bowl of running for our sport.

Cory Nagler [00:06:28]: Yeah. Absolutely. And I I I think just as a fan of the sport, watching the Olympics? It definitely is the Super Bowl for our sport. Dylan, Rory kind of talked about you guys meeting in Flagstaff. How did that transition into you ultimately, becoming Rory's coach? And what do you think some of his training goals were back when you started working together? Or was he already focused on the OTQ? You.

Dylan Belles [00:06:51]: Yeah. Rory had jumped back and forth between some road races as well as some trail races, at least over the years that We knew each other, and we worked with each other off and on. Rory had a coach who was really well versed more on the trail Dean. And so he would actually work with him most of the time. And then whenever we wanted to focus more on, you know, the marathon, the dynamics of trying to train for an OTQ. You know, Rory and I would work together to try to create a plan to to help him take the strength That he gained from training on the trails and try to translate that into a little bit of speed. I think knowing and being around Rory, It's easy to see where the natural talent is. His ability to run fast is certainly there.

Dylan Belles [00:07:39]: All it really just would take was, Ideally was to take some of the things that he's really good at, and then just layer on a level of specificity for the marathon that would hopefully, You know, lead him to being able to OTQ. So during our time, we just it was kind of a it was very more of a Fluid coaching, coach athlete relationship. You know, we play we had a bunch of different hats. You know, we were we were friends. We were roommates. We were, you know, travel companions. We know we did a lot of things together. And so, yeah, it was it was very Unorthodox in the sense of a coach working directly with an athlete as, like, a high school or college athlete was, but it also allowed me and us to work

Cory Nagler [00:08:30]: Yeah. No. It sounds like you have a very, close relationship that kinda walks the line between, friend and, and coach Theta, I'm curious Yeah. Dylan, if if you had to describe it in one word, what would you use?

Dylan Belles [00:08:43]: Honestly, I believe the word would be easy Because and and the reason why I say easy is because a lot of times when you're working with athletes and especially as someone who has a runners connect coach and who's trying to connect With hundreds, thousands of athletes who live all over the place, sometimes it's really hard to have those tough conversations and to really, you know, speak directly to someone When you don't get to see them in person, you don't have that hands on effect of things. And so when you've really developed a relationship with someone like Rory, someone I'm I'm with, you know, almost At all hours of the day, it's really easy to have a conversation and to say what you wanna say directly without feeling as though You have to be really careful or tiptoe on things. So that's that's my rationale behind easy. Not that it's easy to train someone, not that it's easy to accomplish this goal, but it's easy work with someone who has a similar understanding as you do.

Coach Ruiari [00:09:36]: Not that it's easy to live with me. No.

Cory Nagler [00:09:40]: So, Rory, I was gonna say And

Coach Ruiari [00:09:42]: And working. Yeah. We had a podcast together too, Up tempo Talks, formerly. So love the work you're doing with the new one.

Cory Nagler [00:09:50]: Mhmm. That's awesome. Rory, I I was gonna ask you your thoughts. Yeah. Is is your kind of executing the challenging workouts that Dylan's writing for you? Would the word you describe also be easy, or what's your feeling on that relationship?

Coach Ruiari [00:10:02]: Is workouts easy? No. That's also why, You know, just to make this applicable to people who are listening, I think having a personal coach personal coach just takes it to the next level. You know, a little bit more accountability than, say, one of our guidance plans if you're with Runners Connect. Even better, of course, which you can't always get is if they're in the same city or Count as you. But, yeah, it just adds another layer of accountability and he can run the workouts with me, if not Kick my butt. I mean, he would drag me out the door some days and, that was just extremely motivating. And as he referenced, One of my challenges is I'm kind of a hybrid. You know, I I specialize in the 1500 in college, so I like to run fast.

Coach Ruiari [00:10:49]: I'll hop in short fun events, and then I was falling in love with the Arizona trail scene. So I kind of wanted to do these trails and ultras, And with the pandemic, those races were happening whereas the road marathons kinda got shut down. So I was kinda just, Really, to be honest, picking random races, doing what I thought was fun, and, I was doing pretty well, but I think this past year in 2023 Is when I really decided to just buckle down. I had my trail running coach. I went back to Dylan. We weren't living together at the time, and then it I think that was just kind of like a different shift too. I was like, alright. He's seen me.

Coach Ruiari [00:11:29]: We're kind of doing our own thing, but this time, I really wanna buckle down. Let's focus all in on the marathon. And with the exception of a couple fundraises that I did, because Is traveling something is a non negotiable for me? Yeah. I put aside a lot of those fun distractions, and we did Road racing across the board and then even what's more important sometimes is not to race. So a lot of times when I wanted to go out there for the weekend races, I skip them. I did these kind of grinding workouts, which you can get into. One of them on the famous Camp Verdi loop, which is about an hour south of Flagstaff in between Flagstaff and Phoenix, and, yeah, I really appreciate the to go back to your question, some of those sessions you put down On paper or on the app. So we can get into that if you'd like.

Cory Nagler [00:12:17]: Well, one of the reasons I love you getting into these really challenging workouts Is because my understanding is that, Dylan, you are also training for the marathon yourself and actually racing, at the Olympic trials? And it sounds like maybe you even been training together in Flagstaff. Rory, were you actually running some of those workouts with Dylan, and and how do you think that helps to maybe have similar goals to your coach?

Coach Ruiari [00:12:42]: You know, this past calendar year, we did not run as much. Dylan also has his own, distractions like the Ironman, races that he was doing, and that's just another degree Of commitment and between scheduling his bikes and, swim sessions, it was it was hard to catch him. So, perk though of working with him and being in the Flagstaff community, which is another major factor in being able to run fast here, is he Obviously, I have friends too, but he could put me in contact with people and some of his athletes who are doing similar sessions. So I had probably a core group of 3 runners that Our mutual friends and training partners that I was running with. So in this case, not Dylan, but he is one of my favorite, training buddies for sure.

Cory Nagler [00:13:29]: Awesome. And and Dylan, even if you're not necessarily running the workouts right with Rory, do you find it helpful on your end as a coach to know that he's kind of chasing some of those same goals as you've had?

Dylan Belles [00:13:40]: I do. I think it makes it very relatable too. I find it really important as a coach no matter No matter if you're on the same level or not, just experiencing the same type of daily grind, being able to put yourself in their in their shoes. And I I think that's that's something as a coach have to do. I think it's really important for for me or for Rory to be to to train because that really the the more you step away from training as a coach, it's harder to relate with the athletes. So I think my my past, my history, and then sharing that with Rory, you know, it all it also intersects as well because I can understand and feel and know or know how he feels or what he's feeling because I too am experiencing or have experienced the same thing.

Cory Nagler [00:14:26]: And so on this piece of kind of having gone through the same thing, obviously, in your most recent attempt to OTQ, it was successful given you'll be competing. But do have some of those similar experiences with working really hard towards a goal, maybe even if that isn't the OTQ and coming a little short?

Dylan Belles [00:14:44]: Yeah. Yeah. I certainly do. I think

Finn Melanson [00:14:47]: we all do. Yeah.

Dylan Belles [00:14:48]: I think the the OTQs are kind of the The icing on the cake. They're the tip well, not the icing on the cake. They are the it's the tip of the iceberg. I think running is is is one of those sports where You fail all the time. You know, it's it's so easy to to not p r, to not have the same workout, to not be able to get out of bed and do what you wanna do every day. It's It's very easy to have small small failures in in in attempts to have something positive or to have these Big successes. So I would say my experience with let downs and setbacks is something that I'm I'm very well tuned I'm very well tuned into, and it's something I can really relate with anybody who isn't able to hit their goal the 1st time or the 2nd time or the 3rd time. But I think What's what's really important to understand here is that it's it's very easy to run away when you don't hit those goals.

Dylan Belles [00:15:46]: It's so easy to just kinda throw in the towel and quit, but it's really hard to just face it and just keep running towards it. And so that is has always been my mindset as an athlete, and Hopefully, what I try to give to people as coaches as well is, like, if it doesn't work the 1st time, give it a 2nd try. If it doesn't work the 2nd try, you give it a 3rd time. And it's just A lot of times, it's it's all about just keep going at it. And if if you can do that, you can be consistent over a long period of time, then ultimately, it'll It'll you'll you'll flourish. Actually read a quote recently, and it was, like, we underestimate, you know, how much or we overestimate How much we can accomplish it and accomplish in in a short period of time, but we underestimate how much we can accomplish in a long period of time. And I think that that relates heavily to to running and training.

Cory Nagler [00:16:32]: Yeah. And and I I'm sorry. Go ahead, Rory.

Coach Ruiari [00:16:35]: I I really, valued Dylan's feedback too. That's why I think if you have a coach who's gone through similar things, he just knew how to respond whether it was like a little push when I needed it, You know, pointing out when workouts did go well, and then if I did have kind of a defeat, you know, let's say one of the half marathon tune ups leading up to the The trials I needed to run, you know, we wanted to go 107 or 106, and I ran, like, a 110, 30 or 50 or something like that, you know, which sounds great to a lot of people, but one of my slowest times in a while, and he'd been there, you know, he'd He'd run the OTQ time and had just terrible tune up races leading up to it, so he reminded Me of that. And then to get to the the big one that we where we shot for the moon at CIM, you know, and it it didn't go Away. I know we're kinda jumping around with the timeline. I really appreciated how he followed up with that. You know, I'm sure you guys have finished a race and it doesn't go how you want, and maybe the non runner friends, even the runner friends, they don't quite know what you're going for. They'll just say good job and It almost kinda stings. You wanna say thanks, but he just I mean, he didn't even acknowledge it.

Coach Ruiari [00:17:51]: He just said something to the fact of, I know it didn't go your way. Let's talk when you're ready, and he kinda gave me that space to, just reflect and be sad about it.

Cory Nagler [00:18:04]: Yeah. And and did you find that, as you were chatting with friends and family, do you do you have a lot who Dan, the running space, or or was it really mostly Dylan that you were going to to get that feedback after the race?

Coach Ruiari [00:18:20]: What was cool, a lot of my friends in Arizona, who really in tune with the scene, they kinda know the basic paces and if I got it And I did it in how important that was to me. But, yeah, there are just some people who, would say good job and, know, it's kind of annoying, but then I also realized, like, some of those people, like, maybe loved ones and family who, didn't really understand it, I was kind of making it such a big deal. I was like, I need to get this to prove I'm this kind of runner, and then, like, my family and friends are just Treating me the same way, and I I kinda learned, like, not to link your time to what kinda runner you are, which seems obvious. But it was just a reminder, like, my Family are like, you're still the fastest runner we know. Like, you're awesome. And I was just so crushed because I was I even told Dylan one of the motivating factors was to, Kind of force a family reunion in Orlando. I have some family members with health problems, and Florida's kind of a meeting spot where some of us are based. So I kind of wanted it to be a chance for my family members to see my running up close because it's harder to travel.

Coach Ruiari [00:19:28]: So I just felt Like, I let them down because I'm I'm not in it. But, you know, with some time and reflection, I've kind of, have a different, more positive outlook on it.

Cory Nagler [00:19:40]: Oh, I'm glad you came to that conclusion because I, myself, in addition to a lot of your friends, find the times It would be mind boggling even if it ultimately maybe wasn't the goal you set out to achieve. I wanna take just a step back here in terms of, like, How you got to that point of of going to compete at CIM? So maybe that selection process, once you knew you wanted to hit the Olympic trials qualifier, What went into selecting, CIM specifically as your rates to go hit that mark?

Coach Ruiari [00:20:10]: Experience, I've run it. It was my 4th time running it. If if you ever find a a race where things just click for you, it plays to your strengths. It has rolling hills. We can talk about that course a little bit. It's a net downhill throughout, but you have to be a strong runner. With regards to incline, we live in Flagstaff at elevation. We're always going up and over hills.

Coach Ruiari [00:20:33]: So I and then you get to go down to essentially sea level and race. So I've I've run some really good times there. So kind of going back to after, You know, I qualified for Boston and was in that kinda two thirty territory. The 1st time I ran CIM, I believe I ran 225. Then the next year, I ran 2/23. I ran a 2/22 there and then a 2/21, so I just kept Chopping off time. I love that course, though. I felt really confident.

Coach Ruiari [00:21:03]: It was a no brainer, to go for it. We thought about some kind of pop up events leading up to it, but I had already had 2 marathons under my legs previously With my other coach, so we thought it was better to focus on the training for that. So, I don't know if Dylan wants to comment on that timing and

Dylan Belles [00:21:24]: Yeah. Absolutely. So CIM, if you're in the sub to elite running range of athletes, That's the place to go in the United States for you can guarantee that it's gonna be great competition, great weather, and the course there is very reliable. So it's it's really easy to to jump into that. And the fact that it is it was the last race prior to That within the qualifying window. So if you didn't do it at CIM, you had no chance afterwards. So That race was filled with hundreds of athletes who had the same goal as Rory, and we're all trying to put it together on that same day. So, Yeah.

Dylan Belles [00:22:08]: Rory had come off of a few other races, and the time line wasn't great. And we really just wanted to put more time and focus into Training versus racing. And so we knew that, hey, we had to do whatever we could to get to see. I am healthy, number 1, but Also fit and be ready to compete.

Finn Melanson [00:22:28]: If you're a long time listener, then you know how Formative a g one has been to my overall health. Like many of you listening, I wanna eat healthy and make sure every meal has some type of fruit or vegetable, But that doesn't always happen. That's why AG one has been such a game changer. It's as simple as adding a scoop to my morning glass of water, and now I have the added Ease of mind that I got all my micronutrients in even on days when I do eat a lot of fruits and veggies. Not only that, but I was able to replace my multivitamin with something that's better absorbed, And I've needed less caffeine thanks to the natural energy from the adaptogens. AG one is the supplement I trust to provide the support my body needs daily, that's why they've been a partner for so long. If you wanna take ownership of your health, one of the best ways is with a g one. Try a g one and get a free 1 year Apply a vitamin d 3 and 5 free a g one travel packs with your 1st purchase.

Finn Melanson [00:23:21]: Go to drinkagone.comforward/rtt. It's drinkagone.comforward/rtt. Check it out. We all know how important recovery is for our training, Improper recovery always starts with nutrition. Simply put, you need to give your body the nutrients it needs to repair the damage done from the hard work you put in. That's where our newest product from Previnix comes in, Muscle Health Plus. Muscle Health Plus combines clinically effective doses of creatine, HMB, BCAAs, and estrogen to make the most comprehensive muscle health supplement available. Together, These ingredients are clinically proven to decrease muscle breakdown, increase lean muscle mass, boost protein synthesis, Enhanced strength, improved body composition, and more.

Finn Melanson [00:24:12]: I'm fanatical about my post workout nutrition and I used to take all these ingredients individually. Now I have the convenience of a single scoop to get them all and at a cheaper price. To check out the science for yourself, head to runnersconnect.net Forward slash muscle and use the code r t t t fifteen to save 15% on your first order. Plus, they offer a 100% money back guarantee. No questions asked if you don't feel the benefits too. Again, that's runnersconnect.net Forward slash muscle, and use the code r t t t fifteen to save 15% on your first order.

Cory Nagler [00:24:52]: We're reflecting back on your training block. Did you feel that you checked those boxes? How how did training go leading up to that? What did it look like? And and did you feel like you were healthy and fit, come race day?

Coach Ruiari [00:25:05]: Yeah. I'd say on on paper and definitely with how I felt, I hit a lot of the the markers that I needed to. So, Dylan's very, you know, intentional with the workouts. I reference traveling. I I was in Europe for about a month with this Travel company I worked for and took a couple weeks afterwards to to just explore. And I was running a little bit and, you know, he accommodated, With just some time based fartlecks, and I got back and, you know, it takes a while to get readjusted. So we did a lot of time based workouts, like, You know, 20 by 2 minutes, but maybe kind of breaking it up with some rest. 20 by 2 minutes at roughly the goal pace.

Coach Ruiari [00:25:48]: 3 by 20 minutes. But within that 20 minutes, you have a 1 minute on, 1 minute off, and then you'd kind of creep up, you know, maybe do 8 8 by 1 mile repeats at the 5:15 goal pace. And then as you progress, maybe you're doing 4 by 2 miles, A 4 by 3 mile at that pace, and then finally, I think one of the the harder workouts, it's just that the distance I found the 3 by 4 miles at 5:15 pace. I was just kinda dreading that one. You know, I did in some different formats. You can practice the marathon pace in many different ways, but that one is just kind of a grind. And, yeah. So appreciated those those sessions you put together.

Cory Nagler [00:26:30]: So my Canadian brain doesn't really work in miles, so I'm having trouble translating this into a marathon time. But, Dylan, as you were going through some of Rory's workouts, what were your thoughts? Did were you thinking on the day that he had the fitness?

Dylan Belles [00:26:45]: Yeah. I mean, I definitely believe that the workouts that Rory were was doing, there were some of the best workouts that I've ever seen Rory do. And in terms of the pace plus the length Of of what he was doing. And some of the runners that he was training with as well were also saying the same thing. So that was really good feedback for me to see because I wasn't able to be there And and run with him and watch him during the time, but he was also getting feedback by this training partners that, hey, you're running some of the best The workouts that I've ever seen you do. And that's really good. That I like really I like hearing that because that tells me that Rory's in the right in the right position, in the right place. So to get him to be able to do some of those those training sessions were definitely gave me confidence.

Dylan Belles [00:27:31]: And and knowing Rory's history and his Training and how he's always been able to race better than he trains, which is good. That's what you want every athlete to do. You want every athlete to be able to, Yep. Not race their training, but, you know, train so that they can race. So that that was great. I was really happy with that, And I will I will mention, and I'm sure Roy will mention this as well, but things were going really well. Training was clicking wrong really well, and then Had a half marathon a few weeks before that just really didn't go it just didn't go well. And and Rory and I both knew it.

Dylan Belles [00:28:06]: You know, we addressed it. And there wasn't really too much to think on because these races happen. It's it's almost, like, 1 out of 3 people have a bad half marathon race in preparation for the marathon. It's just a part of the training. Roy was running a 100 plus miles per week. He was doing it on tire legs. Didn't have a really high expectation of him that day. I I did feel as though he was carrying an awful lot of Fatigue and just kind of fell into a bit of a hole going into the race, so we scaled back and With hopes that, hey, he could respond.

Dylan Belles [00:28:41]: And the week of the the week of the race, he was feeling pretty good, so we had no other We had another we didn't have an inclination that things were gonna go south by any means. And it did turn out to not be because He didn't feel fit, but for other reasons in which I bet, Rory will likely go into.

Cory Nagler [00:28:59]: Mhmm. Alright. So let's go into it. Rory, if it's not fitness, what do you think happened on the day?

Coach Ruiari [00:29:09]: Yeah. I mean, race day can bring a lot. Anyone who's raced the marathon knows it just takes One little factor to throw your day off, you can control as many variables as is possible and, Yeah. If it if it's just not your day, things unravel quickly. I I will say, yeah, the the half marathon gave me a little bit of an ego bruise, But, scaled back was, you know, trying to do a little bit more of an aggressive taper so my legs were feeling more lively. But I still had some kinda lingering doubts about the pace, while I was hitting that that mileage too, something I've referenced, maybe with people who know or follow me on Strava is I have This ongoing Achilles issue, which is essentially Haglund's deformity, so it's a bone spur on the heel that, you know, it's just kinda angry during the bigger miles and Footwear was critical, so I was really the number one thing I was nervous about. I've I'm pretty good by now at Knowing how to fuel, I knew I was could handle the distance, I could handle the pace. I was just trying to figure out what Chew would be least likely to aggravate my heel.

Coach Ruiari [00:30:21]: I even had a late night decision where I Dylan was one of the last people I texted before the race. I brought 2 pairs of shoes. My advice is just bring 1. Decide before the trip. So even on the shakeout runs, I was, like, wearing different versions of the vaporfly, the 2 and the 3, and I wavered. I There's something I didn't like about the 3, so I went with the 2. In retrospect, those that pair was probably a little tapped out, too many workouts on it. I'd actually run CIM in that same shoe the the previous year, but also it was kinda comforting.

Coach Ruiari [00:30:55]: And, I kinda knew within 8 miles actually as we went out with the pace group, just a wall of pacers going at this 5:15 pace. So it's really nice. You just know where you have to be. Some people go ahead of that group if they wanna be aggressive. Other people are Further back, I'm right with the group for the 1st time, running CIM, but I kinda just had this feeling like This shoe is feeling a little more lifeless than I thought. You know, I did a my final little 4 by 2 minute workout a few days prior, and The shoe felt pretty zippy. And then sometimes when you're racing, you just have to be aware. Yeah, it's just a different, obviously, intensity.

Coach Ruiari [00:31:37]: And the shoe just didn't feel good, and I don't think that was the defining factor. I was trying to kinda power through it. I was within contact of the, 5:15 pace by around mile 11, but I just had this thing in the back of my mind, worrying about This flare up. And sure enough, before I even got to the halfway point, I described it's my go to description. It's My Achilles is just angry at me, and I I was just really mentally trying to get it together. You know, I've noted my breathing. It was okay. My heart rate was Maybe in the 1 sixties, mid 1 sixties where it should be.

Coach Ruiari [00:32:15]: So I I knew I could do it aerobically. And then, 1, the Achilles was angry, and 2, mentally, I just kind of gave in to the injury. I was, like, it's back. Like, I can't fight this. And, You know, I saw that halfway point. I was at maybe what was it? 109 30, which I've gone through in that time before and, you know, thought of, like, trying to negative split. I wanted to go through it maybe One zero nine or faster. The time is 2/18, so hitting it out of the nose is a pretty safe bet.

Coach Ruiari [00:32:51]: You don't wanna be too far under, but this 10930 felt kind of just it didn't feel good, so I knew it was gonna be very hard to negative split. And within just seeing that halfway barrier, honestly, I just kind of I almost Set aside the goal. I just knew it wasn't gonna be possible and switched to survival mode, which I know a lot of runners have done. But yeah. The the pain was pretty bad to the point where I wanted to drop out, and I saw these runners who had gone with the the Pacers, pulling off the course, you know, seeing their friend, cheering them on, grabbing their cell phone. I was even so with it. I could hear the conversations, like, Hey. Can you pick me up? I dropped out.

Coach Ruiari [00:33:38]: And it was, like, I'm at mile 14.5, and I was just like, man, I'm only here, and I wanna drop out like them. This is this is gonna be rough, and it hurt really bad. So I just, Assess the situation. I I know the injury. It's not necessarily gonna, you know, sideline me anymore. The logistics of getting to the finish with a Par would be hard. I didn't know anyone I could call or have a phone number memorized. So I was just like, let's log it in.

Coach Ruiari [00:34:06]: This is the last race of the year and, you know, it was more about, yeah, getting there, and maybe it'll inspire some of my friends and other athletes that I just toughed it out so that I tried to stay as positive as I could, but, that was probably not my mental dialogue.

Cory Nagler [00:34:24]: Yeah. No. It It sounds like a real battle, and I I wanna say, I think it absolutely is inspiring. And I'm sorry the race didn't go the way you envisioned, but I think we've all been there where You put in the hard work and you feel like you're fit, and sometimes it just doesn't come together on race day. But again, like, I I know you had really high hopes. It sounds like training was going well. Also, when you do cross that finish line, what are some of the first thoughts going through your head?

Coach Ruiari [00:34:53]: I mean, ultimately just, disappointment. I had a a good cry. I haven't had a A nice cry after a race for a while just acknowledging all the time I put in. And, I don't know how useful it is, but it could just be a good Release to let yourself be sad about it for a while. But I knew people who had had good days there, and I actually saw a couple of my training partners also struggled. So I couldn't really be sad for too long because you're catching up with people trying to find people where they're at. I mentioned I was in a lot of pain. So, Yeah.

Coach Ruiari [00:35:30]: I mean, I actually had some friends. It's pretty common. Obviously, the window had closed, but I already had some friends and training partners talking about the X race they were doing, and I was just so defeated. It's just you know, I'd worked so long for that goal. I just I typically would advise runners to, Yeah. Just allow yourself the period to kind of absorb what happened, learn from the mistakes, realize it's not in vain. You know, training and fitness can take years to stack up. It's gonna make you better, and I just gave myself a little bit of space to, To not rush to the next move, and and that seemed to to help.

Cory Nagler [00:36:09]: Yeah. And I I think this is a good takeaway for Anybody who's listening that runners of any level go through this, whether your goal is to finish your 1st 5 k or to OTQ. There's there's always going to be times where things don't your way. So I I really appreciate you coming on today to to share your story, Rory.

Coach Ruiari [00:36:25]: No problem.

Cory Nagler [00:36:26]: Dylan, from from your perspective, what do you take away going forward from this both in terms of lessons to be learned and maybe goal setting?

Dylan Belles [00:36:36]: Yeah. Absolutely. So I think number 1 is that when we look at a 4 year training cycle. So if the goal is to, hey, I wanna put this together again and and give this another try for 2028. So then we know that that's at least a minimum commitment of 2 years. So it's the window will open up again in 2 years so that when people wanna qualify for the trials, they can do so. I think really the biggest takeaway that I've Gathered from from Rory and his training is that if this is a goal that he continues to want to have, and I still and I still believe he's in the with Within the window of of a realistic opportunity. And I don't think it would be there are definitely Sometimes when it might be a stretch for some people and it might be a lot harder, but Rory is a lot closer than he is further away.

Dylan Belles [00:37:29]: And we'll see what the times are next time around. But if he wants to do it again, it's going to take 2 or 3 years of dedicated Road slash marathon training. Because there's a big difference between training for the trails, training for an ultra distance race, and then being able to turn that back around And run a marathon. I think one of the greatest examples was, Jim Walmsley from the previous Olympic, cycle. So Jim is world renowned trail runner, one of the best in the world to ever do it. And he took it upon himself to try to do the marathon trials and, you know, a lot of big goals, pressures were put on to him, and he ran really well. Ran he was 15th. You know, he was round 15th in at the trials.

Dylan Belles [00:38:17]: But really the difference is if if Jim wanna put himself in a situation, he needed not just 6 months of training, he needed Years to accumulate that the same specific training that comes for the marathon. So I think the takeaway that I've I've gathered from this training cycle is that Despite it being one of Rory's probably his most probably his most memorable marathon, unfortunately, but also, like, One of the hardest on his body on his mind is that, like, there's there's still more there's still more to give And there's still more time to to get better at the marathon, and I don't think he's tapped out by any means. So if he really wants to continue pursuing this, and we had this conversation a few weeks back, it's gonna take a little bit more time, a little bit more dedication to this specific task of being able to run 5:15 Per mile? You know, we're roughly in the 3.15 to 3.16 per k, I believe, for a whole marathon.

Cory Nagler [00:39:19]: And what what do you take away from this entire process, Rory? Are you fired up for the next goal or taking some time to kinda settle down before picking what's next?

Coach Ruiari [00:39:28]: I'd I'd say still more licking my wounds, you know, giving myself a little bit of time to recharge. I I already referenced the fun races I like to do and some trail events. So despite knowing I need to dedicate even more to the marathon, That window is a little far off, so I'm gonna try to just recharge, and, yeah, be ready for the next cycle. But, I guess what I'd just point out for those people who are having a bad race, definitely or had a bad race, just use it as a time to kinda, Like I said, reflect and then work on those weaknesses. So a lot of people for a lot of people, it may expose, you know, stuff they already knew. My hamstring, I didn't do enough strength, and that for me is gonna be something I address. Worst case scenario, potentially surgery. I haven't ruled that out, but I wanna exhaust the the physical therapy options regarding my Achilles and, The bone spur.

Coach Ruiari [00:40:29]: So I'll kind of take that year to see what I can how I can manage it and, you know, maybe put together a plan with Dylan. Again, I definitely wanna work with him. But, 1st and foremost, I also think it's important if you have a bad race, Another way to pick yourself back up, cheer for other people. Like, you can be bitter and be, like, I know all these people who got into Boston, and I didn't. You know, you can take that approach, or you can be or upbeat, like, be excited that they have the opportunity. And that's how I really feel about Anyone, especially the runners from Arizona who I've, like, trained with. I've paced some of them for workouts. Like, I'm gonna be there in person in Orlando.

Coach Ruiari [00:41:10]: Gonna be yelling my face off for Dylan. Just you know, they have the honor to be out there. And even if they're way back from that pack who's making the team, it's just, You know, such a accomplishment and, yeah, cheer cheer for the other people who got the chance. So that'd be my My last

Cory Nagler [00:41:31]: thing. Awesome. And for yourself, Dylan, from your coaching perspective, are there any specific lessons you might give to athletes who worked really hard for a goal and came up a little bit short?

Dylan Belles [00:41:41]: Absolutely. I I think that Rory really touched upon it Really well in in saying that it's it's really important to give yourself some space first. I think the easiest thing that you you do is when you cross the finish line, After all the emotions subside is, what race am I going to do next? And as a coach, I think that's the worst thing that you can possibly do. It it really just it it's it's a denial of what just happened, and you're not you're just trying to put a Band Aid over it And replace your negative feelings with the hope of something positive. And while I have I have done this myself, and to some extent, I understand how that can certainly work, but I don't think it's a really I don't think it's a good mental habit to get into. So I think it's really important to give yourself some space, take some time back to do a full reset and not look for the next race, the next marathon, but really Take the time down. Recover. Do whatever you need to do to not become a runner for a little bit.

Dylan Belles [00:42:43]: Just relax. Do some things that you don't normally do, And give yourself that full time to just hit the reset button because what you'll find is that You'll start to overcome some of the the clouded thoughts that you had in your mind, all the negative stuff that comes, Especially in those 24 to, you know, 72 hours after the race where you're just constantly just beating yourself up and just telling yourself how How how bad you are. It's really it's really unhealthy. So, you know, once you kinda get over that space, you give yourself some time. You start to think clearly, And then you can help develop or strategize a plan with your coach, with the RC coaches, whoever you're working with at the time, To create something that's a little bit more in the distance. And that way gives you time to distance yourself from The the negative emotions, the the bad memories that just happened, and it gives you more of an opportunity to, create Better ones moving forward, and ultimately get to a place where you wanna be again.

Cory Nagler [00:43:48]: And for you and Rory, in terms of getting to that place where you wanna be again, you've kinda mentioned that You're taking a step back to kind of evaluate before you jump to the next goal. So so what's really the focus in in that point in terms of getting back to a place where you're ready to jump towards another big goal? Dylan, I'll I'll ask this to you, and then maybe Rory if you have any other thoughts. Yes.

Dylan Belles [00:44:07]: Yeah. So for Rory specifically, he's he's been doing this for a long time. He knows how to recover. He doesn't do things on a whim typically when it comes to high performance. He he talks about he likes to go do some of the fun races, and that kind of stuff will be things he likes to do. You know, it may it might come up next month and he'll sign up for it. But he's actually very responsible when it comes to giving himself the time and space, and that's why he's been able to stay healthy and and mentally engaged for this long. I mean, Rory has been training hard for a very long time, and the reason why he does that is because he does incorporate his own recovery, his own He respects his body in that sense.

Dylan Belles [00:44:47]: So Rory will take the time that he needs and we just actually talked Last night, about and and last week, actually, about, hey, we're we're gonna have to start getting back into to training again. So we talked about maybe putting something on the schedule just so that he can stay in touch with with training, but nothing that's gonna overwhelm the system. So my thinking is that he's gonna give himself some time to recoup, to do what he needs to do, to do training on a very loose basis, And then allow himself to naturally kinda get back into that that that frame of mind that says, hey, I wanna train. I wanna get ready for something, and I'm ready to do everything I can to do to get there.

Cory Nagler [00:45:31]: Yeah. And, Ray, any thoughts on kind of what you're doing to get in that head space?

Coach Ruiari [00:45:37]: Man, I I I mean, this is why I have Dylan to be my coach. He's, yeah, so well thought out. Yeah. I mean, I I agree with that approach, and, yeah, I think there's a difference. I just like to touch on those people who like to race a lot. I find as a coach, I'm Holding back the reins on some athletes, but there's some runners I know well enough where I know they can go into an event And hold themselves back. So if you can maybe practice race situations where you are able to have fun, if you're a competitive Person without going to the well, that can be a good way to satisfy the itch without compromising your Your training. So, yeah, I I take very seriously if if I'm gonna do a race and I wanna perform well, like, I note it in some way.

Coach Ruiari [00:46:26]: I'm really Focusing on that, and then I try to remove all expectations if it's, yeah, the weekend trail race. So it could even be a 50 k, But just having that permission or agreement with yourself, like, hey. If the, whatever, the fast high schooler goes out And he's just throwing down these miles like this isn't your day to try to race him to, to get the glory. So, that's something it takes practice. You gotta learn.

Cory Nagler [00:46:56]: Yeah. No. I I love that. I actually, myself came off the last race where I went into it with a bit of an injury and knew I was gonna have to walk dog from the start, and it was exactly that mindset. Having to tell yourself there's gonna be people going out hard and just having Pull yourself back, I think, is a really tough lesson that sometimes takes experience.

Coach Ruiari [00:47:14]: It does.

Cory Nagler [00:47:15]: Just to kinda Close this out just because I want to provide people as much value as possible here because it is such a great story how much time and effort you've put into the school. I'm curious. I'll start with you, Rory, and then Dylan, if you have any kind of final thoughts or takeaways for people who might be listening and, finding themselves in that same process of Working really hard to accomplish something and and and having, their running revolve around an upcoming goal, or or maybe who thinks that they might have that goal coming up in the future?

Coach Ruiari [00:47:46]: Yeah. So first, I guess the main thing I wanna go to is just enjoying the process. You know, what I found is after the race is a little bit, like, grieving as Dylan alluded to when you don't have that Goal there? It's like this gaping hole and you're missing something. So that's tough. But what you can do In the meantime, and sometimes you need to remind yourself while you're training for that. Now that I look back, I realize how fun it was to have that singular goal. Everything every time I woke up or did some little thing, strength workout, I'm like, hey. This is helping me towards this goal, and it just gave each day and training purpose.

Coach Ruiari [00:48:26]: So Some at some point during that training process, I would like make it a point to enjoy that part of it. Like, I miss those workouts where you went to Camp Verde. I referenced this popular spot. Nice farmlands with mountains in the distance. There's actually, like, livestock there, like llamas, sheep, horses, and me and 3 of my best friends, training partners. We got Craig Hunt, Josef Kretzmann, Angel Ramirez, we're all doing this workout at the same pace, and, we're really hurting on the set. And I just told Like, we're saying, like, 3, 2, 1. We're about to go.

Coach Ruiari [00:49:04]: Said, hey, guys. Let's have fun with this. We might not ever be here again training at the same time Towards the same goal. Let's do it. And that's true. You know, everyone has different stages of life, whether it's Being married, maybe having kids on the way, injuries come up, and I I just really that changed my perspective of that workout. It's just like we're out here grinding. This doesn't happen forever, and you can't always compete at this level.

Coach Ruiari [00:49:32]: So I'd say enjoy the process at some point During the the suckiness of marathon training.

Cory Nagler [00:49:40]: Yeah. That's something I've been trying to do a lot more myself is embracing that suckiness trying to enjoy it? Yeah. Dylan, you've actually had some of these same goals. Do you have any kinda final takeaways for our listeners?

Dylan Belles [00:49:51]: So I think Rory really touched upon the process really well. I think within that, it's it's really important to have process related goals as well versus outcome goals. Because if if we put everything on the outcome, then it really takes away from our appreciation of everything that you did leading up to it. While Rory didn't have the races that he wanted leading up to the trials or sorry, not the trials, but to leading up to CIM And and and hope for making the trials. There was still a lot of progress that he made throughout the process. So I think it's really Important for for all of our runners and everyone who's listening to make sure that no matter what happens, you're still able to look back and see What you've done, what you've accumulated, and and what you where you've gotten better. One of the things that I actually did Prior to one of my races recently is I started writing out contract to myself. No matter what happens, this is how I'm gonna feel, this is what I'm gonna appreciate, and this is what I'm gonna see The matter if it goes well or if it doesn't go well.

Dylan Belles [00:51:00]: And I find that I found that and I signed in and everything. I find that What that really did was it it held me accountable to myself so that despite and, you know, just a it it did not go well, just to let you know. And but because it didn't go well, but it didn't go well in terms of what I wanted from the outcome. But because I made this contract to myself in race, I was able to overcome my own mental hurdles To get my head out of the sand and be able to appreciate what I was doing and when I was doing it. And then afterwards, I was able to appreciate everything I did leading up to that event. So I think for everyone who's listening, we all have identities as runners, But our identity does not equal the race result, the pape what's on paper. You're still gonna wake up the next day. You're still a runner.

Dylan Belles [00:51:54]: You still have Goals. There are still things that you're gonna be able to accomplish. And because it didn't go well that one time, you don't equal that. So I think that Rory Had he nailed it right on the head when he said to focus on the process and to really enjoy that because ultimately, that's what matters. And if you can see that and and and know that what you've accomplished over a long period of time is something that is gonna always live with you, then I think you can at the end of the day, I think you can be really happy with that.

Cory Nagler [00:52:25]: Dylan, thank you so much for sharing your thoughts. And Hopefully, you can apply those same lessons as you prepare for the Olympic trials coming up in February. So I think I speak on behalf of, of everyone here as well as the RT community when I say good luck there? And Dylan, Rory, thank you so much for coming on the show today and and sharing your story and and all that's kind of come this process to try to achieve the OTQ? I think it's it's a really inspiring story that I that I hope our listeners will learn a lot from be, because I I Found it so inspirational today. So, Dylan and Rory, thank you both.

Dylan Belles [00:53:00]: Thank you.

Coach Ruiari [00:53:01]: Hey. Thanks a ton. Good luck, Dylan.

Cory Nagler [00:53:18]: Thanks for listening the run to the top podcast, I'm the showrunner at runners connect, where as always, our mission is to help you become a better runner with every episode. You can connect me on Instagram at Corey underscore Nagler. Work through Strava by searching Corey Nagler, and please consider connecting with the rest of our at runnersconnect.net. If you're loving the show, you can help us reach more runners by leaving a rating on Spotify or Apple Podcast. Lastly, if you want bonus content, behind the scenes experiences with guests, and premier access to contests, and consider subscribing to our newsletter by going to runnersconnect .netforward/podcast. I'll see you on the next show. But until then, happy running, everyone.