Lessons From The Fastest Runners On Earth

Finn Melanson [00:00:14]: Hello fellow runners. I'm your host, Finn Milanson, and this is the Run to the Top podcast, the podcast dedicated to making you a better runner. With each and every episode, we are created and produced by the expert team of coaches@runnersconnect.net, where you can find the best running information on the Internet, as well as training plans to fit every runner in every budget. How can the average athlete relate to some of the best runners in the world? What insights can be gained and in what ways are we more similar than we are different? These are just a few of the questions addressed in this episode of Run to the Top. We host author Sarah Gearhardt, whose recently published book titled We Share the sun takes readers behind the scenes and into the lives of some of the world's most elite runners in Kenya and their legendary coach, Patrick Sang. We talk about Kenyan running culture, the philosophy of one of the greatest and the least heralded coaches of all time, the importance of developing character and purpose in tandem with physical fitness, life in the training camps of E ten and the unique challenges that Sang's athletes face in changing media and performance landscapes of this sport. Lo's Smart Protein takes the guesswork out of finding the optimal protein amount and blend for you by drawing data from your wearables and fitness apps such as Strava, Peloton and Apple Watch to provide specific dosing recommendations after every workout. Timeline Nutrition has developed a groundbreaking product called Mitopure that revitalizes your mitochondria, which create energy in nearly every cell in your body. Head to timelinenutrition.com to learn more. Sarah Gearhardt. Welcome to the run to the top podcast.

Guest [00:02:10]: Thanks so much for having me. It's a pleasure.

Finn Melanson [00:02:12]: We are here to discuss your book titled We Share the sun the Incredible Journey of Kenya's legendary running coach, Patrick Sang, and the fastest Runners on Earth. We were just talking offline. I really enjoyed this book and one of the recurring themes is the quote, unquote why that underlies the commitment to running and Kenya running culture. And I figured we could start out the conversation by extending that to your career as a sports writer. What is your why for a book like we share this on?

Guest [00:02:42]: Well, my why in general, as a writer is I like to tap into stories that I feel are deserving of attention and individuals, communities that are underrepresented in media. That's really my why to give attention and to give light to communities that I feel are making a difference in the world. And if I don't see it being talked about, then I should be the one to do it. Yeah.

Finn Melanson [00:03:16]: What in particular and you talked there about underrepresented stories and in general, underrepresented areas of sports and in culture. What in particular attracted you to Kenyan running culture and the life of Coach Patrick Sang?

Guest [00:03:32]: Yeah. So just to kind of digress, I have interviewed a handful of runners from East Africa prior to writing this book, including Wilson Kipsang and Mary Kaitani. And I just kind of felt that in Western media there has been a shortage of journalistic narratives as it relates to the human side of the athlete in running and professional running. And I've sort of just felt that they're kind of positioned as what can you clock? How much faster can you go? But what about their life outside of the sport and how they're contributing to the community, I think is really important too. And so I have thought about that or thought about that for quite a while. And it was in 2007 when I was at the Boston Marathon. I was profiling. Emmanuel Mutai, who was the number one entrant in the men's elite field. And at the time we happened to have the fourth fastest marathon time, which is now like number eleven, I think. And it was really interesting just to kind of go behind the scenes. I had the opportunity to go behind the scenes during the weekend of the marathon and just in conversation with him, him explaining to me what his life was like in Kenya. I just became increasingly curious about the country, and I really wanted to go there for a project. So fast forward to 2019. I wrote a story for runners world about Gordy, Ainsley and the Western states. 100 yes. I don't know if we saw that story, but a year later it had caught the attention of a literary agent in New York who reached out to me asking if I was interested in elaborating on that story and turning it into a book. And at the time, while I respect ultra running, trail running, I respect it. I just didn't really feel that was the direction I wanted to go with my work. Not to say that there's not space for that story to become something more in depth, but still I had this fascination with East African runners and I wanted to do something more in that lane. And so in conversation with the literary agent, I declined that idea and I said, hey, I actually have an idea to maybe do a series of profiles about some East African runners, some of the best in the sport. And we went back and forth and he basically told me to keep thinking. And so I pivoted and I thought, okay, well, who is responsible for producing or developing some of these athletes? And as I was researching and I came across Patrick Sang, I was really curious because I didn't really know that much about him, to be honest. I had no relationship with him, I'd never interviewed him, I had never met him at any of the major marathons, surprisingly. But I saw that he was a collegiate athlete at the University of Texas in the became curious, like, well, that must have been quite an experience coming from Kenya to Texas in the 80s. In addition to that, the fact that he competed in two Olympics and medals, he won silver medal in 1992 in the steeple chase, and that was the first time that Kenya actually swept the podium in the event. So these little details combined, of course, my research was quite limited. I just thought, okay, I need to explore this. And so I went back to the agent and I was like, okay, well, here's my idea. How about a book about Coach Patrick Sang? Who coaches Elliot Kachogi? And so, yeah, we started to explore that. And so I had to be introduced to Coach Sang, which we happened to have a mutual contact who has known him for many years, over a decade. And I had a long conversation. This is like a long answer to your question.

Finn Melanson [00:07:48]: No, this is great. This is great.

Guest [00:07:50]: A long conversation with this mutual contact. He was like, you know, I got to be honest. I can't say that Patrick will agree to this. He is a bit of a private person, but I'll at least talk to him about your idea. And so he did that, and I don't know what became of that conversation, what it was about, but after that, coach saying was at least open to me presenting the idea to him, which I did. So I actually had a really long outline. My book proposal ended up being 50 pages. So I had presented him the idea that included, here are the chapters that I'm thinking. This is the order, this is the timeline. And then we went kind of back and forth. That included a few phone conversations in which we talked about we talked about things not related to running. It was like life, like politics, education, et cetera. And at the time, that was when Trump was in office. So there was always, like, a lot to talk about. Yeah, and it was really interesting. I could tell that he was someone who could really navigate a conversation quite well, and he could talk about any topic, really. And I thought that was really interesting because not everybody can not everyone is well versed in that way, or is well read in that way or pays attention to world affairs in that way. But he certainly does. And so it was a few months later, after all this back and forth, I was actually really close to dropping the idea because I didn't think that he would agree to it because we were just going back and forth so much. And intuitively, though, I felt like I had to keep going. And maybe that's partly because I'm a runner myself. I run a lot of marathons, and there's always that thing in you that tells you to keep pushing. So that's what I did. And ultimately, he agreed. I think it was like five months later or something like that, and he was open to doing it and moving forward. So, yeah, it took a lot of work. Eventually, though, last year in conversation, we were kind of laughing about it. And he told me that he was testing me, which I kind of gathered. Yeah.

Finn Melanson [00:10:25]: I want to get into the details of the book in just a minute, but you said something interesting earlier about how the status quo in the world of running is to focus or to emphasize performances over the humanity of the athlete. And I'm curious, just based on your conversations with Coach Patrick Sang and observations of Kenyan running culture, did you get any sense of why we've gotten to this point where that is the status quo?

Guest [00:10:53]: I think people are really drawn to they're really drawn to performances. I mean, just look at the storytelling around Elliot and his sub to attempt. Yeah, I just think that people are really fascinated by that. And you want to see electrifying performances, but there's always more to the situation, there's always more to the athlete than what they're capable of. Clocking I've always felt that way. Yeah. And just having interviewed several Kenyan runners or East African runners, I know that there are pretty heavy back stories that I find really powerful and inspiring that I think should be shared. Because in order to get to that number that people want to see, or the electrifying performance that people want to see, there's a lot that goes into it beyond just the training.

Finn Melanson [00:11:55]: Well, getting into the book just a little bit, I think one of the things that struck me initially was it wasn't just a book about running. There was some surveying of cultural differences and just how people in different parts of the world think about life and approach day to day life. And I bring that up because at one point in the book, patrick says that when he reflects on his time in America, I believe this is when he was at the University of Texas running versus his time growing up in Kenya. He thought that people were happier in the latter scenario, despite living below the poverty line. And he goes on to say that Kenyans are privileged in ways that others around the world will not come close to achieving. So those that visit Kenya should come home with a big lesson. And I'm curious, did you get a sense of what those privileges were and sort of what the lesson of all that is?

Guest [00:12:48]: Yeah, it's almost hard for me to answer that because I think everyone's takeaway is different. Like, we all experience life situations, people very differently. And when he made that comment, he didn't explain it. X, Y and Z, this is what you should learn. It's more like when you're there in that environment, pay attention to your surroundings and the people and just really absorb and observe. And I think one takeaway, I mean, I'm hesitant to say because everyone's experience is unique, I really appreciated that the culture is really communal and that it's something that is strikingly different from what I've experienced being in the US. It's not an individualistic society, and maybe you remember, but there's a part in the book where he talks about what is poverty like. Poverty in the US. And poverty in Europe. That's a different meaning of poor versus when you're poor in Kenya, someone will at least kind of take care of you, look after you. And I thought that was a really interesting comment or observation that he made because, I don't know, maybe you would agree, but it is kind of true. Having spent so much time in New York and parts of Los Angeles, I see there's a really heavy homeless population, and I can say, yeah, people will walk by someone lying on the sidewalk and just step over that person rather than stopping to ask, do you need help? Do you need anything? Et cetera. And that's just kind of one example, if you can understand what I mean. Yes, like that.

Finn Melanson [00:14:46]: Well, I think one of the reasons why I was curious about your answer is you also spend a fair bit of time talking about the training camps in E Ten and going into detail about what they have in terms of gadgets and food and shelter. And it seems like they are taking a much more spartan approach to all of that. Whereas if you look at the pros in America, they'll typically be souped up with the latest, greatest accommodations and gadgets and stuff like that. And yet there is, in a lot of cases, a performance difference. I mean, these canyons on the world stage tend to be outperforming Americans and Europeans and other athletes across the world. Of course, there is the doping question in some cases, but by and large, they're outperforming them. So I'm curious, what did you seem to think were the differentiators was it that feeling of interdependence and in Camaraderie versus going at it alone as an individual? What is their sort of secret sauce for success?

Guest [00:15:50]: Yeah, I mean, I can't really pinpoint one overall secret that really helps them sort of like supersede, supersede in the professional running space. And I don't want to compare and say it's just like, okay, they do tend to live more humbly and a more simple life. And I don't want to say the quote, unquote, lack of technology that maybe we have here in the US. I don't want to say it's limited to that. I mean, there are so many other factors. But I'm going to actually read this quote from Brother column, please, that I found really interesting because I was talking to him about this. We had so many long conversations, and when it comes to the mental toughness, mental endurance among Kenyan athletes, we have this discussion as to why that is. Why are they so mentally tough? And Coach Seng had said to me, when you're born in a poor environment, you're likely to go to poor schools, so you are likely to have limited education when you become an athlete. This background influences how you project yourself outside and within athletics, whether you like it or not. So related to that, Brother column told me that when you look at the breadth of Kenyan athletes who have been successful, you can't point out more than one or two that didn't come from a rural upbringing like what Coach saying just described. Yeah. So the quote is, except for maybe one or two at most, individuals all come from rural peasant farming backgrounds. There is no athlete that you can point out that wasn't born in a rural area. Patrick as well, he slotted into what was a very fundamental aspect of his life and lifestyle, which means that young kids are very toughened in the soul, toughened in the character. They know what hardship is about. They know what it means to suffer. They know what it means to break the pain barrier when it comes to a race. They've been through it their whole lives. So if you ask me to compare some of the differences that I've noticed, I would say definitely the mental endurance. And I don't want to say this is exactly the only reason why, but very much your upbringing for sure shapes your confidence and your mental toughness. So in that regard, I thought that was strikingly different from some of my experiences or the people that I've been exposed to in the US. Or Europe.

Finn Melanson [00:18:44]: I had asked you earlier in the conversation about your why for writing this book and why you've chosen your vocation. It struck me that this was equally important to Coach Sang in terms of understanding where his athletes were at and why they wanted to do what they wanted to do. What was your sense for why Coach Sang thought it was important to develop character and purpose just as much, if not more, than physical fitness for these athletes in their races?

Guest [00:19:11]: Yeah. So there's a quote in the book that Coach Sang says. It relates to how you are beyond an athlete. If you can become a human being who contributes to society, you conserve humanity for a long time. So at the end of the day, he has repeated this phrase that you are more than just an athlete. And I think it's important to consider how you want to stand in the world and how you want to contribute. What kind of statements do you want to make outside of sports? And in regards to that, I'll just give you a couple of examples. I know that he's adamant about his athletes giving back. So there are two athletes that I talked to about this Jonathan and Levon career who said that, for instance, when they travel to a race, usually they bring back extra gear and they give it to local runners who are in need because they pointed out the fact that they didn't get to where they are without having someone do the same thing. So it's like that ripple effect and it gets passed on and I think it's really lovely. At the end of the day, it's not just about you, it's about the we, not the me.

Finn Melanson [00:20:45]: Protein often takes a backseat to carbohydrates when we focus on our nutrition, but getting adequate protein, especially post workout, is absolutely critical for recovery. But there's so much conflicting information about just how much our body needs to be optimal. Is it zero, eight or 1 gram/lb of body weight? Does it matter if you're male or female? Enter Ello. ELO's Smart Protein takes the guesswork out of finding the optimal protein amount and blend for you by drawing data from your wearables and fitness apps such as Strava, Peloton and Apple Watch provide specific dosing recommendations after every workout. Ello's Smart Protein comes in either grass fed whey or pea protein and can include other functional ingredients like probiotics and ashwagandha to help you recover faster and support your goals. Take the guesswork out of all this and get the right amount of protein after every workout. Go to lo health and enter code RTT for 50% off your first month. That's ELO Health and enter code R-T-T at checkout for 50% off your first month. Timeline Nutrition's Mitopure is backed by over a decade of research and is clinically proven to revitalize Mitochondria. So every cell in your body has the energy to do its job and keep you healthy and functioning, right? In fact, clinical studies have shown that 500 milligrams of urolithin, one of the main ingredients in Mitopure, can significantly increase muscle strength and endurance with no other change in lifestyle. Mitopure comes in powder form to mix into your favorite smoothie or soft gels to make them easy to take. Improving your mitochondria is one of the best things you can do for your health, and with Mitopure from Timeline Nutrition, it has never been easier. So go to Timelinenutrition.com and use promo code runners connect for 10% off the plan of your choice. I'll be the first to admit I was a little skeptical about how much a green supplement like AG One could actually help me. I generally eat healthy, try to get in whole fruits and veggies, and know that oftentimes supplements aren't as well absorbed as real food. But I made it a big goal of mine to get healthier overall after the 2020 quarantine. So I dug into the research about how much greens could help and what was the best on the market. All of the research pointed to AG One being the most comprehensive and well dosed greens supplement on the market. In fact, one of the things that I like most about AG One is they list all of their ingredients and quantities. They don't hide behind proprietary blends, which is almost always a quick way to know if a supplement is a scam. The sheer number of ingredients is overwhelming at first, but once you dig deeper, you can see that this is actually what makes it the best product on the market. They're also NSF certified, which means they go through rigorous testing to prove that the contents of the product match what is on the label. I also did a lot of research on how AG One are made. I mean, how do they squeeze that many ingredients into a single scoop and does that diminish the nutritional value? Well, turns out they actually dry or dehydrate the ingredients and crush them into a powder. This results in almost zero nutritional loss. If you've been skeptical about using a greens product and how effective it could be, I really encourage you to give AG One a try for 30 days. You can even get a free year's supply of vitamin D and five free travel packs if you start now, just head to Athleticgreens.com RTT to give them a try. Just so you know, in terms of the listening audience, a lot of the folks are they're in the road running scene. They're training for five K, ten K, half marathons. Marathons. Maybe some folks in the trail scene like me. A middle of the pack type runner, maybe a back of the pack type runner. An older audience as well. So not necessarily people at the very front end of the sport, tip of the spear, trying to progress the limits of human performance. But I still think that there are some good lessons here. And did you have any takeaways in terms of what this type of audience can take away from the approach that Kenyans have to the sport? Because from the book I got the sense that it's very no nonsense, it's very serious minded. There's so much at stake because they're trying to make a livelihood of it. What can the average runner take from this?

Guest [00:25:13]: Well, I think one of the most interesting observations I had that I think is applicable for any runner is the idea of being present when you run. And by that I mean, I've for sure been around enough runners that you go for a run and it's more like a social thing that you do and you want to catch up. And it's not like really training, which is fine. I mean, there's always a place for that. But my experience in Kenya, I never came across groups of runners or even an individual who was like that. They were really focused, they were really present. And when they run, they run in silence and they don't listen to music and they don't stop to take photos. And I actually really appreciated that because I'm kind of the same way. I like to go out and I like to really be immersed in the experience and not distracted in any way. So I guess that's one bit of advice is to really be present in what you're doing. And I think that it sounds kind of obvious, but I think more often than not, people really aren't that present when they run. And I think that can affect you. It can affect you in lotteries. It can affect you just say, for instance, on race day, if you're not being present, then you're not really training your mind, if that makes sense.

Finn Melanson [00:26:45]: It's a great thought, and it makes me wonder, given how physically and mentally taxing their jobs are, because I think in their culture, running is more often a profession than it is a hobby. Did you get the sense that this present mindedness, this effort to be present on the run, that it to some degree offsets a lot of the pain and suffering associated with what they're doing?

Guest [00:27:12]: I don't mean that to say that they don't ignore what they're feeling. They're just aware of it. And I think that when you're aware of it, say you have, like a muscle cramp creeping in, you're able to at least manage it rather than let it go to your head, if that makes any sense. So, for instance, if you are not present when you run, and then you get into a situation like a race and you have some kind of pain, and then it can go to your head, and then you start to worry, and then it can make you unravel. Yeah. And so you know the saying, when the mind goes, the body goes. And so I think that if you're constantly running, sort of like obliviously, then you're not really conditioning your mind. And ultimately, I think that can really affect you in a situation that requires you to maybe be a little bit more serious, if that makes sense.

Finn Melanson [00:28:12]: If you think about it in terms of camps, like folks that take a really disciplined approach to running versus folks that maybe take a more carefree hobbyist approach, do you fall into one of these two camps more firmly? Given your experience in Kenya, do you feel like they're mutually exclusive? Can they coexist? What are your thoughts there?

Guest [00:28:34]: I don't want to say that one approach is like the approach. I think everybody is different and surely it all is circumstantial. It depends on where you come from, how you're raised, et cetera. But there it just seems to work. It just seems to work. So who's to say that this way that I experienced and observed in Kenya is the way that everyone should be? I'm not saying that I think that there's space to approach running in different ways, but in Kenya, this is how they go about doing it, and it works for them.

Finn Melanson [00:29:13]: A couple of questions I wanted to ask you about the economics of the sport and some of the extra pressures that Kenyans have on the world stage. You mentioned in the book that the market has different expectations for these Kenyan athletes versus, say, American or European athletes, and that in order to get perhaps more sponsor dollars or more recognition. They don't just have to hit a certain time, but they probably have to run even faster than it. And so much boils down to performance versus storytelling and relatability. Can you go in depth about this more and just what makes this the case?

Guest [00:29:51]: Yeah, so just to clarify, that particular comment is attributed to Coach saying he had mentioned that to me. And I'll just say I think part of it is because there is so much talent in Kenya that goes unnoticed. And so I think the nature of the sport in Kenya is that it is extremely competitive, competitive on another level that you couldn't even experience in the US or in Europe. And it's as though runners in Kenya are having to outrun each other in order to get attention because the talent is so deep, if that makes any sense. So, for instance, I came across a local runner in E Ten, who I think his PR is like a 215. But he told me that in order to get anyone to even look at him, you'll have to run for sure sub 210, which, when you think about that, that's really fast. And if you were to think about someone in the US running sub 210, they're probably like a local elite, right? If not an elite. But there it's like you're kind of like one among many. And I just find it really interesting. I think that's kind of what I mean, if that makes any sense. The talent pool is just so deep that you have to run faster in order to get attention. Yeah.

Finn Melanson [00:31:30]: And off that, there's another interesting comment in the book. I'm not sure if you're editorializing or it's from Coach saying somebody mentions that we've gotten to this point with social media where the common person can be someone with equal or more star power than the athletes, with actual ability and performance, et cetera. And how this is less possible to leverage in a place like Kenya, a place like E Ten. Did you find in your time there on the ground researching that this was starting to undermine their ability to make a living purely off performances? And also, is it having an impact on how Coach Sang chooses to mentor his athletes about what it means to be a runner in the sport program?

Guest [00:32:17]: So that comment, I wasn't editorializing it. That was actually a comment from a running coach in New York who is a pretty good runner. I mean, he runs, I think, around like 240 for the marathon. But my point with that was that he has so many sponsors that are willing to support him. But when you think about, okay, when you compare his marathon time with 240 to a local elite in Kenya who is running 215 or even a little bit faster, he doesn't have the same kind of exposure because the culture of celebrities, social media. It just doesn't really exist there, if that makes sense. And so I guess the opportunity to have what this running coach in New York has, it just doesn't really seem possible at the moment in a place like E Ten. So runners can't really take advantage of a situation that this running coach has. It just isn't really possible. Does that make sense?

Finn Melanson [00:33:35]: Yeah. And what were some of the tangible limitations that he noticed?

Guest [00:33:39]: Tangible limitations? As in, can you give me an example?

Finn Melanson [00:33:43]: Like an inability to leverage social media, like a lack of access to phones, knowledge of how to operate social channels? What were some of the limitations?

Guest [00:33:54]: I mean, I think maybe a combination of both or maybe not everyone has Instagram or not everyone has a smartphone. So like that yes, in a sense, yes. But just the idea of being a social media celebrity, it's just not existent there from what I experienced.

Finn Melanson [00:34:20]: Yeah, it's so interesting to me because I know that there was mention in the book is it the NN running team and how they've been able to pour money into these teams and essentially not just funding advances in recovery and performance and travel to races, but also marketing dollars. And it surprises me that there wouldn't be marketing dollars going directly to that avenue to help them stay relevant and to compete, at least in the social.

Guest [00:34:47]: Media game, alongside I mean, obviously I think NN is a little bit different, but that's really specific to the training camp. So in that regard, that doesn't apply to the rest of E. Ten and the rest of Capt Gat. So that's really specific.

Finn Melanson [00:35:07]: And Circumstantial got you well, a couple of other questions. You had mentioned the ripple Effect earlier, and this was a part of the book that I really enjoyed. We've now seen Kenyan athletes dominate on the world stage for the last four or five plus decades. And I'm not sure if it's Coach saying or it's someone else in the book that comments that they hope that the success that these Kenyan athletes are having in the running realm will inspire other people in the community. To reach that same level of belief about their own potential as humans and to bring up other parts of their community and to grow the economy and stuff like that. Were you seeing this ripple effect take place?

Guest [00:35:53]: So that comment is actually from Elliott, and he was saying that because we were talking about Jeffrey, and Jeffrey had to pull out of the Olympics due to an injury. And the discussion was he had actually envisioned Jeffrey being on the podium winning a medal, winning a gold medal. And so, like, part of the conversation was about, okay, well, what does winning a gold medal do for the community? And he said, well, it really influences the community because you see someone from here, someone from this village can do it, then you kind of question like, what am I capable of? And so that's what he means, or what I meant by the ripple effect is that people see that someone can do it and then it's like his signature phrase, no human is limited. You begin to sort of explore your own potential. So that's what he means by that. And I find it really lovely. It's a really lovely way to inspire and influence people, a community in the world.

Finn Melanson [00:37:07]: Awesome. Well, Sarah, this is an excellent book. I really enjoyed it. I read it cover to cover in a short time because it was page turning. I loved the mix of philosophy, of cultural insights to Kenya, how Patrick's team operates as a unit, and what it takes to perform at a world stage again. The book is called We Share the sun. We'll link to it in the show notes. Is there anything else? Any other calls to action that you have for listeners before we go?

Guest [00:37:39]: Yeah, I mean, I'm just going to put this out there. I am in the near future going to fundraise to build a library in E ten where it was based. So that is something that I'm hoping to do. Maybe I will start later this year in the fall because I am planning on training for a marathon, so maybe I'll do it in conjunction with that. But yes, in the future, yes, I'm hoping to build a library.

Finn Melanson [00:38:05]: Well, as those developments come, we'll make sure to shout them out on the pod here and we'll include what we can in the show notes. But seriously, thank you so much for your time. Thank you so much for writing this book. Pleasure to chat.

Guest [00:38:16]: Thank you so much. You.

Finn Melanson [00:38:33]: Thanks for listening to the Run to the Top podcast. I'm your host. Finn milanson. As always, our mission here is to help you become a better runner with every episode. Please consider connecting with me on Instagram at Wasatch, Finn and the rest of our team at Runners Connect. Also consider supporting our show for free with a rating on the Spotify and Apple podcast players. And lastly, if you love the show and want bonus content, behind the scenes experiences with our guests and premier access to contests and giveaways, then subscribe to our newsletter by going to RunnersConnect. Net podcast. Until next time, happy trading.