Digging into the research on caffeine, beet roots and tart cherry juice

Finn Melanson [00:00:14]: Hello, fellow runners. I'm your host, Finn Malanson, and this is the run to the top podcast. podcast dedicated to making you a better runner with each and every episode. We are created and produced by the expert team of coaches atrunnersconnect.net, where you can find the best running information on the Internet as well as training plans to fit every runner and every budget. How do you know which supplements are actually improving your performance on race day, and which aren't? Well, you dig into the research. And since I know all of you listening aren't researchers at heart, or you just don't have the time to dig into everything. We've brought on one of the foremost experts in the world at analyzing research studies and applying them to actual training. Alex Hutchinson. Hutchinson is a former physicist and national class runner and a National Magazine Award winning science journalist. He's the author of Sweat Science, an outside magazine comment about the science of training and fitness that you likely have seen us quote many times in our weekly newsletter. With his, what is the evidence show mantra? I think Alex is one of the best people to speak on the subject of what ergogenic aids are worth trying and which aren't. We'll take a look at the research on caffeine, beetroot juice, and tart cherry juice. Plus, if you stick around until the end, Alex will share the ergogenic age he believes have the most potential based on the research. This is an awesome interview for all of those who love science and nutrition Let's get to it. Today's episode is sponsored by magnesium breakthrough from by optimizers. their industry leading magnesium supplement helps you sleep better and reduce stress. Head to magbreakthrough.comforward/run to the top, to learn more and save 10%. If you're looking for the most effectively dosed electrolyte drink for runners, Check out LMMnt, pronounced element. It's loaded with everything you need to replace your electrolyte balance. and for a limited time you can try elements new grapefruit flavor plus get a free sample pack by going to drinklmnt.comforward/ runners connect. Okay. Let's get started with defining exactly what is an ergogenic aid. So what all on the same page.

Guest [00:02:36]: Yeah. Basically, an ergogenic aid is something that improves your performance. So and and for me to classify it as an erg ergogenic aid, I'd say that it improves your performance in a measurable way. So beyond just sort of making you feel good about things, it it actually has some measurable performance benefit.

Finn Melanson [00:02:54]: 1 of the most studied ergogenic aids is caffeine, but some studies suggest that there's a gene variant that controls how we metabolize caffeine. My question, can caffeine be beneficial to some runners yet do nothing for others?

Guest [00:03:09]: Yeah. I mean, just just to emphasize the positive part before we get the negative part, caffeine is probably the most reliable performance enhancer enhancer we we we know of. it tends to help for endurance events and for shorter, more powerful power base events. And it works for most people, at least that's what we thought until the last few years. There there've been just a couple of studies trickling out in the last year or 2. suggesting that some fraction of people, we don't know exactly what fraction. Maybe maybe slower to metabolize cathy caffeine. So levels build up in your in your system, and you get you sort of get past the positive effect and and to the negative effects maybe because you're a little overstimulated. And there's a few different gene variants that that they contribute. And, you know, it looks like it it could be, I don't know, 10%, 20% of people might have mutual effects, like, might not get really any benefit in caffeine. And there's it it it some studies have hinted, although it's very preliminary that there might actually be negative effects for some people. So there's there's some people who who who always say that just doesn't work for me. It doesn't make me feel good, and it's it's probably worth trusting that intuition And so you may be someone who gets a benefit from caffeine, but is very sensitive to its effect or very insensitive to its effect. So those two things may be decoupled how it makes you feel and how makes you perform. That being said, I mean, you you can get a genetic test to find out, but that's that's kind of maybe overkill for for a lot of people at this point. So how you feel is is one barometer or one one measure to to pay attention to how you perform as another measure. You know? Keep keep track of you know, you can never judge from one race or one workout. But if if you have a pattern, then you should try varying, you know, taking a little bit of caffeine, taking your bigger dose, taking taking no caffeine, try and try and look for systematic patterns there and see maybe caffeine doesn't help you, and maybe it's not something we should be sort of supplementing.

Finn Melanson [00:05:12]: Okay. So if we assume that we are a responder to caffeine, what does the literature say about optimal dosing?

Guest [00:05:19]: So the the the doses that are typically used in studies are usually somewhere between 36 milligrams per kilogram of body weight. So if you're a £150, that's somewhere around 60 kilograms. So that's somewhere between a 183160 milligrams of caffeine, whereas a typical tablet might be a couple 100 grams. So you're talking about 1 to 2 tablets. And it used to be people you you know, we we all have the the instinct that that more is better and if some makes me faster, you know, twice as many pills will make me twice as fast. And that's not the case necessarily. And it also if you have too much Caffeine, even we all we all get wound up before races. And so being, like, extra extra jittery before a race can really backfire And so the the latest research that that that I'm aware of from the Australian industry support suggests that you get pretty much just as much benefit from the lowest range of the doses that I just that's, like, 3 milligrams per kilogram as you do from the higher ones, and you're less likely to have any negative effects. So I would certainly stick with that unless there's you have some reason to think that it'd be more.

Finn Melanson [00:06:28]: So is caffeine absorbed differently depending on the source such as coffee compared to a pill or some other method?

Guest [00:06:37]: Yeah. It it'll be absorbed more quickly through your mucosal tissues, for instance, through from gum. than it would be if you swallow it. So gum I mean, I I just never tried running with gum, so I I can't I can't vouch for for how effective that is. But, yeah, that'll give you a quicker hit than than drinking it, which Thinking it, the the levels tend to about an hour after you drink it is is is when the levels, I think, tend to reach close to peak values. So But that being said, I mean, there's there's certainly you can get a relatively rapid benefit, so that's why, you know, a lot of gels have cat caffeine and and taking a jail with caffeine midway through the race should give you a a a benefit relatively quickly.

Finn Melanson [00:07:24]: Okay. Switching to a different topic. What is the evidence for the effect of beet root juice on athletic performance? Because this seems to be one of the latest supplements being talked about.

Guest [00:07:35]: So, basically, what what scientists have found is that if you take a bunch of reduce and go for a run at a at a at a given pace. You will consume less oxygen than you were if you hadn't taken that en route by by a few percent. So when an an oxygen your oxygen uses is is the proxy measure for how much energy you're burning. So you become more efficient. You can you can you can run at the same pace burning less energy, which has obvious translation to allowing you to run longer or faster while putting out the same effort. So this is a finding that has been replicated over and over again in different labs. And maybe most importantly, it's been replicated or it's been it's been done with double blinded trials where they use they're they're not comparing beet juice against Kool Aid. They're comparing beet juice against beet juice with the difference that the nitrate in the beet juice which is what starts to be the the main act of ingredient is stripped out of 1 on half of the beet juice. And what they find is if you have the beaches with nitrate in it, even though nobody knows whether they're getting the real or the safe beaches, you'll get this this improvement in in efficiency which translates into faster time trial results.

Finn Melanson [00:08:56]: So do the benefits of beet root juice differ when it comes to shorter events like the mile or the 5 k versus the marathon or an ultra?

Guest [00:09:05]: I I think the answer is probably yes. I don't necessarily know exactly how that would play out because it's really hard to do studies with marathons. You can't have people say you know, you can't bring people in on a Monday, have them run a marathon, then bring them in on a Wednesday and have them run another marathon. In theory, my my my expectation would be that efficiency is really important over the longer distances. So for something like a marathon or a half marathon, The benefits might even be maximized. Whereas over shorter distances, efficiency has to be balanced against using anaerobic energy sources too, which which is another source. That being said, the studies a lot of the studies have been done with relatively short cuts exercise, you know, 5 minutes, 10 minutes, to minutes, and they sound benefits. So there seems to be as long as there's a significant aerobic component, it seems like you choose as hell.

Finn Melanson [00:09:52]: How would you advise runners to incorporate beet root into their diets?

Guest [00:09:56]: Well, I'll I'll start by saying that what I do is I eat a lot of beet I I and and leafy green vegetables, which are other sources of nitrate. I and I'm just trying to make sure I have a relatively high level in my diet because I think that the evidence has been pretty strong that that in addition to making you a more efficient runner, they also have significant health benefits in terms of blood circulation. So that's, you know, one the takeaway that I've taken away from this research is get lots of nitrate rich leafy greens and beets in your in your diet. Now for acute performance benefits, this is an evolving area, there there's you know, the the minimum is you take you know, either a shot of each have concentrated beet juice or a bottle of beet juice in maybe 2 a half hours before a race. But Studies increasingly suggest you do better if you load up for a little longer. So there's this sort of next step up as you do. You maybe you take a bottle the morning or one one dose the morning before the race, one dose evening before the race and, like and then one dose just before, like, 2 hours before the race. So over the course of 24 hours, you're taking 3 doses. But there's now some recent studies suggesting that you you might do better if you load up for a full week, leading after, you know, for 5 or 6 days, leading up to the race. So you get chronically elevated levels. and that this will actually produce a better benefit. So you have to balance cost to Beatrice and the fact that it doesn't agree with everyone's summer against the the general sense that loading up for up to a week with 1 or 2 doses a day where dose is a shot or or or a a bottle of juice. is there's there's there's pros and that there may be cons too, so you have to find what looks for you. I haven't seen I haven't seen or heard of anyone taking, you know, pausing for a mid drumbeat juice, which doesn't mean it's not happening, but I I'm not aware of it. And the the the time scales would be juices even longer than it is for something like caffeine.

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Guest [00:14:46]: It it's it generally they think it levels peak, you know, 2:2 a half hours in that range after after you consume it. So You know, maybe if you're doing an ultra marathon, but, frankly, if you're doing an ultra marathon efficiency is less important than than stuff that agrees with your stomach. So for the most part, this is a free race or pre comp you know, a pre competition beverage.

Finn Melanson [00:15:10]: Are there other food sources rich in nitrate that runners might be able to substitute with or take advantage of?

Guest [00:15:17]: There are alternatives rich in nitrate. You should don't like beats probably gonna not gonna like the alternatives either. The the the other big category is we compete in vegetables. So spinach Arugula. Arugula is probably the champion, spinach Swiss Chard. To get the equivalent dose, you basically have to eat, you know, those plastic boxes of a pre washed spinach. That's that's about how how much you'd have to eat. That's a that's a very, very big salad. You can you can blend it up. or or something like that. But so far so far, it seems like the or or peak use is is a pretty effective way of getting the amount you need for this sort of acute usage as opposed to general health. If the arugula marketing board gets us act together and and, of course, some some enterprising person starts selling arugula juice maybe that'll be an alternative or right. And I know the people out there's there's a researcher in Scotland, for instance, who's been working with, like, Swiss chart, paste and and stuff and testing the different properties. So there may there may be alternatives, but it's it's it's hard to to to get that full dose. And the other thing that's that's what's bearing in mind is Not all beets and not all spinach and not all arugula is created equal. How much nitrate there is in in a beat depends on a lot of factors including the soil that was growing. So I'm I'm not a paid spokesman for any particular beef company, but the ones that are manufactured specifically for sport, they they monitor the nitrate levels and make sure that each each, I don't know, each bottle of juice contains a certain amount of nitrate, whereas if you just juice your own beets or go go to the local you know, meet store or whatever and get and get you stare. Maybe you're doing better. Maybe you but maybe you're actually not getting as many nitrates. And in fact, Its grow organic beef may have less nitrate because they they don't use as much, you know, nitrate based fertilizer. So so so There are alternatives, but there are that you have to be sort of aware that it may not be getting much of things you get.

Finn Melanson [00:17:24]: Okay. So the next supplement we get a lot of questions on is tarte cherry juice. What does the evidence say about the performance enhancing benefits of tartare juice?

Guest [00:17:35]: So I well, I should be careful here that I don't take too many negative things about something I don't know that much about. But I think cherry cherry juice is an example of something where the hype is a little bit ahead of the evidence. I'm not aware of any super, super solid evidence that at Art Cherry Juice, it does anything really useful. Now there's some studies suggesting it has it's it's loaded up with antioxidant and anti inflammatory products. Our cherries are great. I have I I have some on my cereal in the morning quite frequently. But the evidence that they're a ergogenic aid as opposed to just a nice food is a little bit weak. And the studies that have been done they suggest that maybe take dark jerry juice while doing some sort of hard exercise like muscle damage act damaging like running downhill or running a marathon, you might have less soreness afterwards. Now there's there's only been a few relatively small studies that look at this And measuring soreness, post run soreness is a really, really challenging thing to do because basic the best measure we have is asking someone hey, how do you feel? How sore are you? And that's subject to placebo effects, and it's can be, you know, the probably the best study that I've seen with tartarajous tried to make it a double blinded study, but they were still effectively offering people tartarajous or, you know, if they collate And so it's it's it's not hard to imagine that they might have sensed which one is supposed to be the the good one. So for cherry juice, Definitely, I think we can say for sure it has useful compounds. And we can say for sure that it has effects on proxy measures, like circulating levels of anti inflammatory compounds. There's a lot of things that affect what's circulating in your blood and and and where we can make a logical deduction that that prob probably this is gonna be good for you. It's gonna help you in some way. But things that can produce an actual measure improve measurable improvement of of performance that are very, very few. And and for me, at least, hard shared uses me yet on the list, although it's as possible there's research out there that I'm not aware of.

Finn Melanson [00:19:52]: So switching gears a bit, do supplements produce the same benefits as real foods? Say, for example, a nitrate supplement versus, you know, beet root juice.

Guest [00:20:01]: Yeah. That's a great question. And in in general, no supplements aren't the same as the foods they they try and replace? Each use is a great example. This is still an emerging area with with conflicting studies, but the most recent evidence that I've seen suggests that if you take so so what we knew what we knew initially is that if you have beet juice and you take the nitrate out of it, You don't get a performance boost. So logically, you might say, well, that means it's the nitrate that caused the benefit. So let's just take the nitrate. But what we also find is if you take nitrate on its own as a supplement, you you don't get or at least you don't get as much of a performance boost as if you took the full beet juice. And the sort of working theory on that is is actually quite complicated what happens when you trade when you take beet juice. You drink the beet juice. It has nitrate in it. You swallow it in your stomach, it's get gets absorbed into your saliva system and circulated back into your mouth where bacteria in your mouth convert the nitrate into nitrate And then you swallow that nitro nitrate rich saliva, and in your stomach, through various process, it's converted to nitric oxide, which is then absorbed into your system and is what produces the the useful effect. Now You know, that last step, the nitric to nitric oxide ends on a lot of things and and one theory is that the other constituents of beet juice including things like antioxidants help accelerate that that final step to turn it into nitric oxide. So if you if you don't have the nitrate, you don't get a benefit but if you don't have the other things, you can't you you don't get as much of the night night trait, making it through the geometric offset. So that's an example of where the whole food together has a greater effect than any of its constituent parts taken separately. And I think that's probably true of a lot of things. I mean, what, you know, you just have to talk about should you eat in orange or should you take vitamin c? Vitamin c certainly has some great effects. Eating an orange almost certainly has more of those effects. And so and and these are things that we're only sort slowly piecing together. So I I would always be in favor of taking the whole food ahead of a supplement whenever possible.

Finn Melanson [00:22:19]: Are there any other ergogenic aids that have been shown in literature to enhance endurance performance?

Guest [00:22:25]: It it's it's a short list. One other class that I guess I would mention is is beta alanine and and baking soda. Those are two things that help buffer the change in in pH. It should buffer the rising acidity during intense exercise. So if you're facing short events, between about 1:10 minutes. Taking either beta alanine is something you take chronically over over several weeks to build up levels in your in your bloodstream and not plus buffers changing acidity in your muscles or baking soda that's the same thing in your bloodstream and you just take that immediately before our race, although it even more so than beet juice, it's something that can trigger adverse digestive reactions. of random anecdotes when when I was in college. I got my first big break. I call I got to run on our our four by eight hundred meter relay team because one of my faster teammates was was loading with baking soda. I don't know. It took for the course of a 2 day meeting and taken so much that we ended up with explosive diarrhea and didn't run the race. So so I I owe one of my big breaks to to baking soda in in an indirect way. Anyway, those two things are are useful primarily in the middle distance races. there's a little bit of evidence that it might might help with a finishing kick even in longer races. There was one study with beta allergy in a very long I can't remember if it was a a couple hour time trial on Cyclone where the the the those who had taken data and were able to sprint faster at the end because they had a little bit more ability to buffer this this change in the city when you go and a road. So Those those are the 2 that I would really really flag for for building muscle creatine is is I think pretty well established as as it works as, you know, in conjunction with training. And and that's kind of a that's that's that gets to the end of my list I think pretty quickly.

Finn Melanson [00:24:20]: Awesome. Well, thank you so much for the awesome deep dive and, yeah, sharing your wisdom with our audience. Thanks for listening to the run to the top podcast. I'm your host, Finn Malayensen. As always, our mission here is to help you become a better runner with every episode. Please consider connecting with me on instagram at wasatchfin, and the rest of our team at Runners Connect. Also consider supporting our show for free with a rating on the Spotify in Apple podcast players. And lastly, if you love the show and want bonus content behind the scenes experiences with our guests and premiere access to contests and get ways, and subscribe to our newsletter by going to runnersconnect.netback/podcast. Until next time, I'd be training.