Overrated OR Underrated: Summer Training Edition

Cory Nagler [00:00:01]: Is it worth getting up really early in the morning or or staying up when it's not even bright out just for the cooler temps?

Michael Hammond [00:00:08]: Heat is okay. It's humidity that will totally wreck it. So I'm gonna say underrated just because I think that it it's it's so worthwhile. Like, it's so good and so worthwhile from so many standpoints that I'm a huge convert. I've been waking up at 4:40 AM to get training in as of late.

Cory Nagler [00:00:24]: The summer is here. And for most of you listening, the warmer weather can bring a ton of new challenges, such as getting your hydration right and trying to deal with workouts that might not be as fast as you're used to in cooler conditions. This makes it the perfect time to cover some strategies you can use to help with summer training in the form of another overrated or underrated episode. If you're new to the show or just need a reminder, this means we'll go over running topics this week related to summer running, and tell you our thoughts on which are worth your time and which ones might be a little overhyped. The key thing I try to remember at this time of the year and when training for a fall marathon is that the goal is to run your fastest on race day, and that it's okay to not be at your fittest now. Coach Michael Hammond has a lot of experience with summer training, so it's only fitting that he joined me to weigh in on this summer training edition. He has some pretty bold takes on topics like whether you should use sunglasses, or if electrolyte mixes are overhyped. He even gave some really interesting tips to stay hydrated before a night of drinking, but that might be a little outside of his coaching expertise.

Cory Nagler [00:01:24]: These overrated, underrated shows are always a ton of fun, and I know you'll be entertained. So let's get into it. Hello, runners, and welcome to the Run to the Top podcast, where our goal is making you a better runner with each and every episode. I'm your showrunner, Corey Nagler. And I'm not an elite runner, but together, we'll explore new strategies and topics to take your running to the next level. This podcast is created and produced by the expert team of coaches at runnersconnect.net, where you can find the best running information on the Internet as well as training plans to fit every runner and every budget. Coach Michael, welcome back to the show, and we have one all about summer training today. So I have to ask you, how are you doing, and how's the weather where you are?

Michael Hammond [00:02:16]: I'm doing great, Corey. I'll tell you what. I live in South Carolina today. This morning when I ran, it was, like, 71 degrees thereabouts Fahrenheit, which is incredible for summer in South Carolina. It was not very humid. I was loving it. That has not been what it's typically been like as of late. It's definitely been pretty hot, pretty humid.

Michael Hammond [00:02:36]: So I'm I'm I'm ready for this conversation to say the least. This morning, I got a little reprieve from it, but I'm ready to have this conversation.

Cory Nagler [00:02:44]: Nice. We we have pretty similar temps where I am, just right around 70, though. It kinda hits me. Like, if you had a race and it was 70 degrees, I'd be almost panicking. But this time of year, it feels super refreshing.

Michael Hammond [00:02:56]: Of course. It's all contextual. Right? Like, that first run of, like, when it gets cooler in the fall, you know, next thing you know, you're throwing on a big jacket even though it's really not that cold. But then by the by January, you're good to go because you're you're used to it. Same Same thing when it gets into the summer, like, when it starts getting warm, you're like, oh, man. It's so hot. But then in the middle of July yeah. Like I said, this morning, 70 low seventies was a huge reprieve from from from where it's been.

Michael Hammond [00:03:19]: So pretty grateful for that, and pretty grateful for our Flagstaff running retreat next week. The temperatures are looking awesome, like highs in the mid eighties, lows in the mid fifties, which is gonna be a heck of a lot of fun for our, everybody coming to our running retreat in Flagstaff next week.

Cory Nagler [00:03:35]: Does your group typically get up early so you can get those temps in the fifties, or do you wait until the sun?

Michael Hammond [00:03:41]: Oh, we we get up early. And I'll tell you what, the first time I did it was 2021, and, you know, it just was like a very uncharacteristically warm week in Flagstaff that week. And I remember I mean, the lows were not too bad. That's the thing. It's up in the mountains. It's up at elevation. Usually, it's gonna get a little bit cooler, but those days, it warmed up so fast. I think it got up to, like, to mid to upper nineties, and it's a very, like, dry heat.

Michael Hammond [00:04:06]: So it was it was it's a very different heat. You know, you'll be out there thinking that it's not that hot. Like, you won't feel that hot, but next thing you know, it, like, it really adds up on you. But I think this time yeah. We still get out early. Like, the day we go to the Grand Canyon. We're gonna leave super early, do a run, and then do a little hike at the Grand Canyon. So it gets warm by the end of that, but when we start, it'll be, yeah, it be nice and cool.

Michael Hammond [00:04:27]: We'll take advantage of those lower lows.

Cory Nagler [00:04:30]: Michael, I gotta tell you, I'm jealous of you. That sounds great. A few days, nothing but running and going to see the Grand Canyons.

Michael Hammond [00:04:36]: That's the idea. That's the idea, man. The running retreat. The good food, good running, and good people.

Cory Nagler [00:04:41]: Nice. Good stuff. Alright. Well, after that little side tangent, what do you say we get on today's topic, which is, overrated, underrated evaluation of summer training topics?

Michael Hammond [00:04:51]: Let's do it, man. Let's do it.

Cory Nagler [00:04:53]: Okay. Cool. I think a lot of listeners will be familiar, but just a quick recap. We're gonna go over some fun running topics. Today, all about summer running because we're still in July and there's a lot of heat to come. And, Michael, you'll give me your thoughts on are they overrated or underrated?

Michael Hammond [00:05:07]: I'm ready. You know, I've always got the the strong opinions on things, so I'm ready to go.

Cory Nagler [00:05:12]: Alright. Let's hear it. We'll start off with our first category, which is all about gear. And I'm gonna start off with sunglasses and more specifically sunglasses specifically for running.

Michael Hammond [00:05:23]: Oh, boy. Here we go. So I'm gonna I'm gonna start off flying out the gate with a bit of a controversial one. I'm gonna say overrated for sunglasses, and I'll give you my reasoning. There's really only one big reason I'm gonna say that. There is some research that indicates that and bear with me here. When you wear sunglasses, because of the different the UV sun and your the sun, and your body reacts accordingly. So it's so for instance, like when you burn, that is your obviously, that's your skin.

Michael Hammond [00:05:57]: That's a skin response to the sun, but your eyes are actually part of what sort of preps the skin for what it's about to, perceive. So there's some research that indicates that actually wearing sunglasses can actually make you burn easier because your your body is perceiving it to be less threatening sunlight, thus not, like, preparing the skin for what you're facing. So I'm not saying, no, don't wear sunglasses. Certainly, like like I was just saying, we're gonna be running at the Grand Canyon on on next Friday in, Arizona. Almost certainly, people are gonna be wearing sunglasses because you're just facing this beaming sun and you don't wanna you want you want the protection for your eyes, of course. I'm not saying don't protect your eyes. I am saying though that there as with many things, there can be potential drawbacks. So I think I think it's one of those things that's like a slight overrated.

Michael Hammond [00:06:46]: I like to take the super hard controversial opinion just to to to make it fun. But it's one of those things, wear them if you need them, but they can be a little bit overrated.

Cory Nagler [00:06:55]: Yeah. I'm interested to hear that because we do see a lot of even pro runners racing with sunglasses, let alone training with them. This is not on my list, but curious, how do you feel about hats as an alternative?

Michael Hammond [00:07:06]: Yeah. I would say a hat would be preferred. It it from the sense that I was just talking about in terms of, like, your eyes perceiving the sun and preparing your skin accordingly. And this is more on a day to day thing. I guess, when you're racing, I think all that kinda goes out the window. Unless you're running like the, you know, one of those brutal, you know, Eastern California marathons or or the, you know, the death marches and stuff where you're just literally baking in, like, a 120 degrees and and sunlight, That's a different story, but, typically, racing is just performance and and also what makes you feel good. I personally think that a lot of people because you'll see I mean, for goodness sake, the best one of the best milers in the world, Josh Kerr, he wore his sunglasses during indoor races this season. Now I don't think he needed the sun protection indoors.

Michael Hammond [00:07:50]: It's just a it's just a look thing. It's just a confidence thing. I think it gives him confidence to put on these cool shades and feel like he looks cool, feel like it makes him, you know, a little bit more confident. So I think that, from a day to day training standpoint, that's obviously a different conversation than something that makes you feel good on race day and and and makes you feel fast, I guess, for lack of a better way to put it. So hats hats probably better from a, from a day to day use case. But, hey, if you stick on those those shades, those stunner shades, and you feel cool, then go for it.

Cory Nagler [00:08:24]: I think, personally, shades definitely get the nod when it comes to running style.

Michael Hammond [00:08:28]: Oh, yeah. Of course. I mean, they look it's just a classic look. They look cool.

Cory Nagler [00:08:33]: Definitely. Alright. Let's go on to our next topic, which is specialized sunscreens. When I say this, I mean, oftentimes, you'd pay 2, 3 times the amount if you want a sunscreen that's designed specifically for running or other activities. Is it worth that investment?

Michael Hammond [00:08:48]: Yeah. I that's that's a good question. I'm glad you asked that right after the sunglasses conversation because I think it's I approach it very similarly. So I think specialty sunscreens are underrated, and the reason why so my to answer your last video question, yeah, I think it's often worth it to pay that extra. So we're talking about, like, mineral sunscreens and sunscreen that is more, purposefully suited to running. One of the reasons I think that is is because it just it just lacks the the the potentially harmful additives that are in more common on the shelf sunscreens, not that all those are horribly unhealthy. And, of course, the problem is people make it such a binary thing where it's either, like, lather on a bunch of sunscreen or get the worst sunburn of your life. Like, obviously, you wanna avoid burn.

Michael Hammond [00:09:35]: Of course, you wanna avoid a burn. But what's interesting is that there's there's here here I go again. There's some evidence that that suggests that's that, excessive sunscreen use, especially, like, more mass marketed sunscreen use, can actually make makes that all that stuff worse, can actually make your skin worse because it's just generally unhealthy for your skin. So these companies that are making more like mineral sunscreens, this stuff is just great for you. You're putting it on. The unfortunate thing is that it also can it doesn't look as good. We actually at our Flagstaff retreat a few years ago, we had this company, Tanri Tanri. I can't remember, how to pronounce it.

Michael Hammond [00:10:13]: T a n r I, And they sent us a bunch of stuff to to give to the people at the retreat, and I took some and put it on. I actually I'm typically the person who I only wear sunscreen if I, like, really need it. Like, I'll gladly be out in the sun for half an hour without sunscreen if it's not beaming, but, I put on some of this stuff because we had had it for free, and I didn't realize we were out at this park. I didn't realize that I looked like a ghost. I didn't realize that because it's it's the type that doesn't necessarily blend in as easily. There's there's stuff. There's chemicals that they put in there to help make it actually blend in so that it doesn't show, but, unfortunately, the stuff that doesn't show is typically a little bit healthier for your skin. So, of course, don't burn.

Michael Hammond [00:10:53]: Don't let yourself roast. But I actually think that those those nicer sunscreens like Tanri are actually yeah. I think they're worth the investment. I think it's a little bit underrated.

Cory Nagler [00:11:01]: I like the visual looking like a ghost, and I'm getting the impression this is almost, the flip side of what we had with the sunglasses. We are saying it's worth it from the sun protection, but it maybe loses a little bit of style points.

Michael Hammond [00:11:12]: It most certainly loses some style points. I looked like a bit of a goof. I definitely got made fun of, and didn't realize what was going on. And I'm I'm already pretty pretty pale and pasty, so the last thing I need is to just be more pale and pasty, which is what that sunscreen did. But, hey, great sun protection.

Cory Nagler [00:11:29]: Yeah. For sure. Take care of your skin. Alright. Let's let's go to our next one, which is in again, we're talking only in the summer. Arm sleeves overrated or underrated?

Michael Hammond [00:11:40]: Overrated. I I don't even have much to say here. I think arm sleeves are are silly. I think if you're if you're a 100 meter sprinter and you're running 9 point something seconds, hey, you wear the whatever arm sleeves you want. If not, lose the arm sleeves. Super overrated. I don't I certainly don't see a benefit other than, again, now we're really just talking style. Now we're really just talking, you know, what you think makes you look cool.

Michael Hammond [00:12:03]: But yeah, hey. If you can go out there and compete with Noah Lyles in the 102100, you you go for it. You wear your arm sleeves. Other than that, it's awesome. Overrated.

Cory Nagler [00:12:11]: Yeah. And I'll tell you where my head was at coming up with this was thinking back to not this most recent US trials, which just took place, but, all the way back to for the Tokyo Olympics, I think Woody Kinkade was in the news a lot because for the 10,000 meters when the temps were in the eighties or even nineties, he was wearing armsleeves.

Michael Hammond [00:12:28]: Yeah. That's what I'm saying. It's that's just a style thing for him. That's just a little, like, confidence thing. I trained with this guy once that would always wear a shirt. And if you ever see if you ever go to a a a practice, like, for a college team or a post collegiate group or something like that and they're doing a hard workout on the track, It's hot in the summer. Pretty much guarantee all the men are gonna have their shirts off. It's just it's just a a the way it is.

Michael Hammond [00:12:52]: This guy would never ever ever take his shirt off, and I swear it was like this little, like, almost mind game type thing of him saying, like, this isn't that hard for me. It's not that hot. I'm all good. I I'm not going hard enough to where I need to. Because we were we were training partners, and yet we were also competitors. That's kinda how post you know, professional track and field is kinda weird like that in terms of you can train with somebody and yet when it comes time to the race, you're trying to beat them. But I always took it as a bit of like a mind game thing that he was like, no. I'm not I'm not tired enough.

Michael Hammond [00:13:22]: It's not hot enough that I need to take off my shirt. I'm all good. He would never take a shirt. He would wear like a long sleeve. I mean, it's like dry fit, but he would wear, like, a long sleeve shirt and not take it off. And meanwhile, it is we are absolutely baking. So, yeah, I just think it's just a style and confidence thing at that point.

Cory Nagler [00:13:38]: That sounds absolutely terrible wearing a long sleeve in the summer. So, personally, I can't endorse that. But power to the guy.

Michael Hammond [00:13:44]: Yeah. Again, we're we're we're not talking about physiological benefits here. This is all purely purely psychological just like Woody Kincaid with those, with the arm sleeves in the 10 k. Purely psychological.

Cory Nagler [00:13:55]: Yeah. For sure. Alright. Let's get into one that's more practical. And, Michael, this was actually your suggestion to bring up as a topic, but treadmill running.

Michael Hammond [00:14:03]: Extremely underrated. And, you know, it's it's funny talking with, like, a conversation like this. I live in South Carolina. I was born in Texas. You know, I'm talking to Corey who's who lives in Canada. I not that it doesn't get warm in Canada. I understand it gets warm in Canada. It's not like it's, you know, Arctic cold all all year round.

Michael Hammond [00:14:20]: But I'll tell you what, especially when you live in the American South, but, really, I've been all over the country. It gets hot everywhere, man. And I think treadmill running is super underrated because people look at it as it's boring. I I'm I'm gonna tell you. I'm someone who's come around on this. This took me a long time to come around. I used to hate treadmill running, but I think it has a great use case, particularly in longer, you know, half full marathon training and longer in that, but even for shorter stuff too. But the, the key benefit, I think there's 22 ways you can use it.

Michael Hammond [00:14:50]: 1 is just a reprieve. So maybe you do an easy run where you're just out there slogging in the heat and humidity all the time. You get on the treadmill. You you feel better. You're able to run quicker paces even though your heart rate stays lower. That's obviously a huge benefit. The other use case is for workouts. I think that so often it's funny at runners connect because we have a lot of athletes.

Michael Hammond [00:15:11]: We're not just sitting here working with, like, a small stable. We have a ton of people using our training plans, using our coaching, and so we see a lot of trends. We see a lot of, like, every single year I'll tell you what. Every single year that I've worked for runners connect, every May, June ish, all of a sudden, we start getting people saying a huge influx of people saying, man, I'm really struggling to hit my paces. You know, I'm I'm really my my workouts are getting slower. My heart rate's getting higher on runs. What's going on? And what we always especially now that we've seen it for so many years, what we always wind up saying is just wait till fall. It's all gonna it's all gonna change.

Michael Hammond [00:15:49]: I mean, this is, of course, why we also have a a temperature adjustment tool where you can put in the the temperature, you put in the dew point, or the or the or the relative humidity, and your paces will actually automatically adjust. We built that because of this exact problem. Treadmill running can be an a great reprieve from that to sort of that that's where it sort of becomes, kind of that combination of a physiological advantage, but also a psychological advantage because we anybody listening knows that when you get in the depth of summer, it can it can be disheartening to have your paces be slower, your effort be higher, just just generally feeling crappy because you're out there slogging it, especially our our, you know, our folks in Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, yeah, South Carolina, Georgia, Florida. It's really, really brutal to run-in that heat and humidity, and I think the treadmill is just a tremendous alternative even if it's 1 or 2 days a week, even if that's it, just to get out of the heat and humidity, get in some cooler temps, get some higher quality workouts, or just get a proper easy run where you're not, you know, slogging through that that, you know, sip sip in the air through a straw because of the humidity. So super, super underrated. Yeah. Love treadmill running nowadays. I've I've really changed my tune on that.

Michael Hammond [00:17:00]: I'm telling you. 10 years ago, 5 years ago even, I would have told you no. I hate the treadmill. Super overrated, but I think actually it's total opposite. Huge 180. I'm a big flip flopper here. I think the incredibly underrated, great training tool.

Cory Nagler [00:17:13]: You know, Michael, that's a compelling case. And as a skeptic, you almost have me convinced. But hear me out. In the summertime, even if there's air conditioning, somehow nothing feels warmer than when you're running on the treadmill even with the fan on. Any suggestions for that?

Michael Hammond [00:17:29]: Yeah. I I you said even with the fan on because that obviously would be my my number one suggestion. That's that's it's tough. I think that's I I swear there's just an element of just getting used to it. I'm telling you. I think I think anyone who is listening that does treadmill running would agree that it's just one of those things that you kinda suffer through a little bit at first, and it it takes a while to get used to. And then once you do it more I I especially started doing it because because of my kids and, with, you know, like, for instance, if if I needed to be in the house, need you know, if my wife is out or something like that, I needed to be able to to run-in the house. And I just got used to it to the point where an hour on the treadmill isn't really a big deal.

Michael Hammond [00:18:08]: And by the way, I, there's this meme going around. I'm not gonna say I I won't use anything, any explicit language, but there's a meme going around on the Internet where people will basically be on flights, and they they'll they'll see people on flights that aren't listening any music. They're not watching movies. They're not reading books. That's what I do on the treadmill. I don't listen to music. I don't watch anything. I just am alone.

Michael Hammond [00:18:28]: I I typically do that with running, but even on the treadmill, which some people think is just, like, blasphemy, like crazy to to not even wear headphones or anything when you're on the treadmill. But, an hour will go by, and it's really not that big of a deal. Maybe on a day where you're feeling particularly crappy, it can be a little bit rough, but I really think it's just something that you kinda have to bite the bullet, and over time, you'll get used to it, and it'll go by better, and and you won't feel so crappy when you're on. I think there's, like, there is a bit more of a mental element, you know, where you just feel trapped. You're sitting there staring at the the clock. You know, you're sitting there, you're just staring it in the face. Whereas out on a run and especially in nature, you can kind of lose yourself in it a little bit, forget about the amount of time that you've been running, get lost in thought, whatever. Yeah.

Michael Hammond [00:19:11]: The treadmill can be it can be a little bit mind numbing, but I think you just get used to it.

Cory Nagler [00:19:15]: Michael, I'm impressed by your mental but I feel like, we should be telling viewers they need to be listening to podcasts, not tuning everything out.

Michael Hammond [00:19:23]: Oh, I know. I know. Yeah. Yeah. Ignore what I said. Here, I'm a you gotta do the, what is it? Do do as I say, not as I do. So don't don't listen to what I do. Listen to what I say, which is listen to our podcast.

Michael Hammond [00:19:35]: Listen to run to the top. Well, on every run, make sure you don't miss it.

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Cory Nagler [00:21:39]: I think time for our next topic. So we'll finish off with the gear and move on to racing and training topics. The first one is getting up super early and super late. So, essentially, is it worth getting up really early in the morning or or staying up when it's not even bright out just for the cooler temps, or are you better off just sucking it up and and running in the heat?

Michael Hammond [00:22:03]: I think it's worth it. I think it's I'm gonna say a little bit underrated to to get up early. And I think the the thing is I do wanna recognize that we are talking to, you know, people right now that are listening that are almost certainly are on their way to work or are getting an early morning run before work or getting a late evening run when they're exhausted after work. So I say it's underrated even though I I also recognize that most of our audience does it already. I think it's one of those things where, you know, of course, there's the sleep element. Of course, you gotta make sure you're getting enough rest. That's, of course, important, but I think that there's anyone who's ever, like who who gets up early, gets a run-in damn near before the sun even comes up can acknowledge that it's a great feeling. It just feels so it feels like a huge mental win to get your training in.

Michael Hammond [00:22:54]: Again, maybe as the sun is coming up, like you're finishing your and, you know, coming back onto your street as the as the sun is coming up. That's a great feeling, and it just I think it sets up the day so well. But also, of course, the other added benefit, you get to you get to avoid the the more extreme heat, the more extreme humidity. There is, like, in in, like, the at least the American Southeast, there's kind of a there's sort of like a window. Really, there's a difference between morning and evening. I I remember one summer I was, I was living in Texas, and I actually would do I was I think I was only running, like, 30 or 40 minutes a day at the time. It was in the middle of summer. I was kind of on, like, a sort of a a break, like a down month from training.

Michael Hammond [00:23:33]: And I remember I would actually do all my runs in the late evening because in the morning, I I wasn't getting up super early, but the morning humidity was so bad. So it was cooler temperature wise, but the humidity was horrific, and so I would go run at, like, 8 PM because, yeah, it was hot. The temperature was at least 90, if not closer to a100, but the humidity was much lower. So I think there can be a benefit to either one. A a good example of, like, an evening an optimal evening run would be a harder workout. Anything that you're like a a temple run, a threshold session, anything harder where you're really trying to hit some paces and pick things up, that can be more optimal in the morning because I swear heat is not nearly as bad for workouts as humidity. Humidity will wreck your workout. You should always adjust your paces like we do at Runners Connect, but but heat heat is okay.

Michael Hammond [00:24:24]: It's humidity that will totally wreck it. So, yeah. I'm gonna say underrated just because I think that it it's it's so worthwhile. Like, it's so good and so worthwhile from so many standpoints that that, I'm a huge convert. I've been waking up at 4:40 AM to get training in as of late just because my my son I I try to be up before my son because let my wife sleep in a little bit more, and I'm yeah. I I've I've always enjoyed getting up early. I've always been more of a morning person, but definitely a convert to the the super early wake ups. We had this guy we had this guy with Runner's Connect.

Michael Hammond [00:24:57]: His name's Corey that I've met at our retreats before, and he runs at 4 AM. Like, gets up at, like, 3:30 and and runs at 4 o'clock in the morning. So I've always I've always respected the people like that, and now I've joined their ranks. So not quite 4 AM, but but very early. It's worth it. It's it it's great. It sets up your day really well, so underrated.

Cory Nagler [00:25:18]: That that is impressive. I, I'm usually up at, like, 5 and 6 for runs, but 3:30, somehow even though it it's not minute wise that much before, it just feels like a a whole other world getting up at that time.

Michael Hammond [00:25:32]: There's something so different about it, man. Like, when you when it when there's a 4 in front of it, you're right. When there's a 5 in front of it, you're like, yeah, that's that's just a normal that's a normal morning. But when there's a 4 or, god forbid, a 3, like, if you have to wake up early for a flight, like, I'll probably have to do on Wednesday before Flagstaff, then, yeah, there's just something different about that. I I do and that's where the other side of this coin, the other side of this discussion is, yeah, you gotta make sure you get enough sleep. Of course, you you have to, but you also have to do what you have to do as as an adult and with responsibilities and and often getting up early and getting the run-in is just what you have to do. So, life is a challenge. Life is a balance.

Michael Hammond [00:26:09]: Right? And but I think it's typically worth it to get on up early and and get it done.

Cory Nagler [00:26:13]: Yeah. Couldn't agree more. The, the feeling of getting it done early is is fantastic.

Michael Hammond [00:26:18]: It's awesome. I love it.

Cory Nagler [00:26:20]: Okay. Next topic we're gonna get into is splitting up your long run. And this can apply any time of year, but I think a lot more people ask about it in the summer just because it can be so tough to to get in those really long, slow, easy runs when it's, you know, eighties, nineties, or even over a100 out.

Michael Hammond [00:26:37]: I'm gonna say a little bit underrated. I I do think that there is value in splitting up your runs. I think it's this is another one of those things that's not binary. It's not either you get the full 14 mile long run or you get nothing. Right? It's there's there's a gray area here. Getting 2 7 mile runs or an 8 mile and a 6 mile whatever instead of doing that 14 mile long run is still really good. Is it as physiologically optimal as getting in that total 14 miler? It's not. It it it it's just not.

Michael Hammond [00:27:09]: There's a huge value in red blood cell development, capillaries, you know, recruiting those fast twitch muscle fibers. There's all sorts of benefits to running over roughly 90 minutes at a time. But when you're talking about in the heat of summer, dealing with humidity and stuff where it's just so brutal on your body to get those long runs in, yeah, I think there can definitely be value. What I would suggest to everybody is make sure that you're fueling and hydrating properly before you resort to breaking up your long runs. Make sure that you're and I mean really hydrating, not just right before the run, the whole all the time. 247, make sure that you're hydrating. I personally find in the heat of summer that I can drink as much as I want. I can eat as healthy as I want, and even then I have to start supplementing some electrolytes.

Michael Hammond [00:27:54]: I just I have to because you just I'm not I'm not a heavy sweater at all. Like, total opposite of a heavy sweater, and yet I still find that even if I'm just crushing the water, you know, do eating great, making sure to add plenty of salt to my food, etcetera, that I still need to supplement electrolytes. So I would I would suggest even though I think it's a little bit underrated to to split up long runs, I would nonetheless suggest that people do everything they can to make sure that they're fueling properly, make sure that they're they're they're fully fueled electrolyte wise, eating plenty of salt throughout the day, taking some electrolyte supplements, however you choose to do that. Make sure that you do that to make sure that it's actually not a fueling issue like that, but if it's if you're doing all that right and you're you're still bonking and just feeling like crap after those long runs, heck, yeah. Split them up. No big deal. Underrated.

Cory Nagler [00:28:48]: Yeah. The the salt thing comes into play so much for those long runs, I find. 1 of our sponsors, LMNT, they they really lean into the whole salt thing. And I find if if you take it when you're not running, it it has a strong taste, but drink that stuff after a long run-in the heat, and it it just goes down so easy. It's like your body knows what it needs.

Michael Hammond [00:29:05]: I had to take a quick water break. Our our conversation reminded me I need to make sure I'm hydrating. Yeah. That stuff is is super super salty. Yeah. We we they send us, samples for our retreats, and I actually last year at Flex, I've tried it for I hadn't tried it before. I tried it for the first time, and I was like, woah. That is mega salty.

Michael Hammond [00:29:22]: Like and you're right. It tastes delicious. It goes down easy. I didn't care for the chocolate flavor. I must admit, sorry, LMNT, if if I'm if I'm, bashing you. I love the the lemon lime and and a couple of the other flavors, but couldn't quite get into the chocolate personally. But, yeah, I mean, anything like that that works. I mean, heck, you can go buy if you're in a pinch, go to the store and buy some, buy some Gatorade and dilute it with water.

Michael Hammond [00:29:44]: You don't need to drink full Gatorade. For most people, it's just a little bit too sugary, little bit too syrupy. But if you just dilute it 50 50 water Gatorade mix, there you go. In a pinch, you know, Gatorade's available everywhere. So, salt tablets are another way to do that as well, but make sure you're getting those electrolytes in and see if that helps with the long run issue. And fuel as well, nutrition wise. You need to have, we can talk about this. I know we have electrolytes and stuff on the on the list, but you need to have your the the fuel in terms of, like, glycogen, glucose that's also gonna help with those electrolytes.

Michael Hammond [00:30:19]: So you can't just take electrolytes and expect that to do all the work for you. You gotta be well fueled holistically all around, in order for those electrolytes to go where they need to go. So try that first, but yeah. Absolutely. If you need to split up the runs, totally worth it to to make sure get the miles in without just totally destroying your body. So underrated.

Cory Nagler [00:30:37]: And we will get to the electrolyte piece, but just one more question on the long runs. Would you recommend that runners plan to break it up in advance, or is that more of a last resort if you find that you're getting overheated well out on the run?

Michael Hammond [00:30:50]: That's a really good question. I would say I would say to to have everything planned out. Like, don't leave it as a last resort thing because I think the issue there becomes you get into some weird psychological stuff of let's be honest. Long runs are just kinda hard. Like, long runs are not a particularly easy there I mean, for some people, it's no big deal. They just, you know, just go out and run 2 hours. No big deal. But for most people, for us mere mortals, long runs are just a challenging mental thing to get in.

Michael Hammond [00:31:18]: So I don't necessarily want people going into long runs with that thought in their mind of, I can break this up. You know, I it's an option because your body is gonna be sitting there telling you, yeah, break it up. Stop running. Right? We we don't we don't wanna just give it that out right away. I think the better solution is to do what we just said. Work on your fueling. Make sure that you're fueling properly, then see how those longer long runs go without trying to break them up. If if, again, if you're still either bonking or you're just feeling like total garbage the rest of the day and into the next week's training, that's not worth it.

Michael Hammond [00:31:53]: Then from there, I would plan to start splitting them up, but only only once you've exhausted all your options and make sure that you're taking care of business with fueling and stuff, then only then would I actually recommend planning to, to split them up.

Cory Nagler [00:32:09]: Yeah. I like that approach, and I think that's another benefit of the morning run is it does give you that wiggle room if you need to slip in some extra miles or another training run later in the day.

Michael Hammond [00:32:17]: Indeed. Yeah. If you start at 8 PM, you might have a rough time, might have a rough time splitting them up.

Cory Nagler [00:32:22]: Yeah. Definitely. Alright. The next one I wanna ask about is dumping water on your head. Is it worthwhile, and is it gonna cool you off, or is it really for show?

Michael Hammond [00:32:33]: Oh, it's definitely worthwhile. Underrated. I think that, putting specifically, putting water on your neck can also help. But, I mean, just in general, it's gonna it's gonna get your hair cooler. Your hair I I'm a person. I have extremely thick hair. I'm not saying that as, like, a as, like, a brag or anything like that. I'm saying it actually can become a problem because I used to have really long hair, and it gets really hot.

Michael Hammond [00:32:53]: Like, 2 summers ago, I think I had very like, some of the longest hair I've had as an adult, like, out of high school. And, yeah. Oh my god. It got so hot. So, yeah, dumping water is gonna help a ton just to kinda get some cool you know, get something cool in there, but also dumping it on your neck specifically. There's I'm a I'm a layman as when it comes to this, but I do know that there's there's research that supports that that will actually lower your body temperature, you know, if you're if you're when it specifically hits your neck, that cold water. So, yeah, I think that that's underrated. It's not gonna sit there and save you if you haven't hydrated well and if you're running in a 110 degrees and high humidity, but definitely worthwhile, like, worthwhile to do in a race if you have access.

Michael Hammond [00:33:34]: If you can get a cup of cold water or something, you don't you're already hydrating, maybe you have your own water and electrolytes that you're using, definitely worth it to, to stop and and throw it on on the back of your on your head and on the back of your neck specifically. So underrated.

Cory Nagler [00:33:49]: Michael, I like the advice, but I don't think you're gonna get a lot of sympathy for your, thick hair.

Michael Hammond [00:33:54]: I know, man. It it's it's funny, especially as I've gotten into my thirties, it's definitely something that, like, yeah. I'm sitting here, oh, no. My thick hair. Like, of course, it's it's awesome, but, like, I I always just have to reiterate. It does come with some drawbacks. It can be very difficult to it it it's very zany. It it's very difficult to to handle, but, I just kinda let it do its thing now.

Michael Hammond [00:34:14]: So yeah. Thankfully, my my, my kids have got seems to have gotten the same thing. My son has my super thick, extremely thick hair, so he'll deal with the, he'll deal with the same when he has his big mop of hair out trying to run-in the summer heat. So

Cory Nagler [00:34:28]: we we've talked about hats already, but, do you find with, with the thicker hair or fuller head of hair that the hat helps, or do you do you prefer to go without one?

Michael Hammond [00:34:38]: I I almost I almost never run with a hat, personally. I it's just it I don't even have, like, a good explanation for that. It's not necessarily something I've thought through. I've the only time I think I've ever run with a hat is when it's raining. Like, that that's the only time I've ever run run with a hat is if it's, like, really a downpour, and, yeah, that's where a hat comes in handy. But, I would think that it would feel I just don't like the I don't know. I generally don't wear hats day to day. It's just not something I find very comfortable, So I don't think I would enjoy it.

Michael Hammond [00:35:06]: And when I when I do it, if it's raining like that, I kinda I don't really like it. I'm only doing it just to keep so I can see when it's when it's raining like that. But, yeah, hats hat's not my thing, but definitely have value for people for sure.

Cory Nagler [00:35:19]: Yeah. Yeah. I, as somebody who is very, very fair skinned, I definitely lean on the hat just for that extra little bit of shade, whatever I can get.

Michael Hammond [00:35:26]: No doubt. I'm I'm right there with you, man. I I need it. Like I said, in Flagstaff next week, I will I will definitely need all the help I can get.

Cory Nagler [00:35:33]: Yeah. Pack a couple extra hats with you.

Michael Hammond [00:35:35]: But thankfully, I'm I'm there with, our other coach. His name is Rory Moynihan, and his first name is spelled r u a I r I. If that's not an Irish spelling of a name, I don't know what is. And Rory is even more fair skinned and and probably easily burnable than me, so I won't, I won't look too silly throwing on my my ghost sunscreen in, in when we're in Phoenix.

Cory Nagler [00:35:58]: Love it. I can't wait to see all the photos from the retreat.

Michael Hammond [00:36:01]: Oh, yeah. Yeah. We're excited.

Cory Nagler [00:36:03]: Okay. Our last topic in racing and training is going to be extending rest versus slowing your paces. And all of these come when the conditions are tough and you maybe need to modify a workout in order to get through it. So which would you prefer if you have to take 1?

Michael Hammond [00:36:19]: Yeah. I would almost always slow the paces first. I think that's just gonna be your your best bet because, ultimately, this is it really do it does depend on the workout. If you're about to run a 5 k, you know, and you're you're absolutely trying to target a certain pace for that race, and this is like a big prerace workout a couple weeks out. You really wanna hit those splits. That's a different case where I think I would probably say just extend the rest because it is so pace specific. But for the majority of your workouts, especially in any endurance training, any marathon training, anything like that, the effort is really what's more important anyway. The effort, the the your lactate levels and stuff like that, that's what's actually more important.

Michael Hammond [00:36:59]: So I would always recommend adjusting the pace first and then seeing if you also need to adjust the, the recovery. You might need to do both. If it's really hot and humid, it's a brutal day, you might even need to do both, but I always tell people just default. Right away, adjust at least 10 seconds a mile, if not even 20, and I know for some people, that's like they can't believe they can't even, like, fathom adjusting like that because they feel like they're not gonna get a good workout. You are gonna get a good workout. In fact, you're gonna get every bit as good of a workout as if you ran the faster paces probably a lot better because you're you're keeping the effort in check. I've done threshold sessions where it's hot and humid and and you're I'm running 10 seconds per mile slower than I normally do, and yet I'm running essentially all out. At that point, it's a it's not a threshold session anymore.

Michael Hammond [00:37:47]: I've ruined the workout. I've done that several times before. So I think adjust the paces first. That should be your first go to, again, unless it's that super race specific, you know, pace prep type workout. Otherwise, adjust the paces first and then adjust the, the rest if you need to.

Cory Nagler [00:38:08]: Yeah. If it is that super specific race pace, is there any sense in maybe taking a completely different approach and just cutting down reps?

Michael Hammond [00:38:16]: Yeah. That's a good question. Probably. But I think that if you let's say you're doing you know, I I mentioned that prepping for a 5 k. So let's say someone's doing 400 or maybe even, like, 800 meter reps at roughly their at not roughly, like, exactly their goal 5 k pace. Let's say you're really trying to hammer down a pace and you were taking 3 minutes rest, just let's just up it to 4. Let's just up it to 4 right away and do half of that just walking very slowly and then half a slow jog and, you know, give yourself time to get some water, get some electrolytes in you between reps and and see how that does for you. But, yeah, I think at some point, no matter what type of workout you're doing, there will come a time where you just have to cut it short and maybe even bail on it because I I keep mentioning the, the threshold workout example.

Michael Hammond [00:39:03]: That's a great example where that's an easy workout to overdo anytime. It's even easier infinitely easier to to overdo that when it's hot and humid. So always on the side of caution. I would say, you know, when it when it's hot and humid, the effort can get out of control really fast, Really, really quickly, it can go from an under control workout to a totally out of control workout, and I swear everybody will probably confirm this from based on their own experience. It's so much harder to get a workout back under control, to get a run back under control when it's hot and humid. When it's cool out, if it's 50 degrees Fahrenheit and you you're you're on a tempo run and you're pushing a little bit too hard, your heart rate's getting a little bit too high, you can be like, alright. I'm gonna back off, take it easy for for a minute here, let my heart rate get back under control, and finish up the workout. You do that when it's hot and humid.

Michael Hammond [00:39:54]: It's gone most of the time. Like, if you're crazy fit and adapted to running in that heat and humidity, you'll probably be okay. But for most of us, the workout's gone by that point. So I I generally recommend a conservative approach to workouts no matter what, any time of the year, any anytime during your training, but I think it's doubly so when it's hot and humid. Just on the side of caution even if it seems slow to you. Your the later parts of the workout will thank you for having been so conservative early on. So just take that conservative approach, but slow the paces first, then extend the rest, and if all else fails and and the workout's gone, let it go. Don't chase it.

Michael Hammond [00:40:33]: You know? Don't chase the rest of of the workout, and and let it become something out of control. Let it become essentially a race effort. Don't do that. If it's gone, bag it. It's okay. It's just one day.

Cory Nagler [00:40:44]: Yeah. Yeah. I think fantastic advice. Alright. We'll come to our last topic, which is nutrition hydration. And, Michael, you already alluded that we were gonna touch on this topic, but let's get to it. Electrolyte tablets, are they underrated or overrated?

Michael Hammond [00:40:58]: Oh, this is a this is a tough one for me because are electrolytes overrated? No. But, like, as a general concept, of course not. But a lot of the electrolyte products that are on the market, I think are a little bit overrated, and I'll tell you why. I am not a huge fan of the move, and it this is just because what the market demands, so the businesses are gonna supply it. I'm not a huge fan of the big move towards 0 sugar with with electrolytes. I'm not saying they need to be loaded with sugar. Like I said, if if you go get a Gatorade, dilute it with water. It it's way too sweet and syrupy and sugary on its own.

Michael Hammond [00:41:34]: But sugar, glucose helps I mean, look up the research on this. It's very clear cut that it helps to get those electrolytes where they need to go. If you have let's say you have, like, you're in a state of glucose exhaustion. Like, you haven't had any any carbs, any glucose in 24 hours or something like that. Your body will will start to shuttle out those those electrolytes. It's essentially like in a it it's going into, like, a starving aim. We're this gets into a big nutrition topic, but I think it's still not important, nonetheless. The the the brands the electrolyte brands that do have a little bit of sugar, it's not just there to make it taste good.

Michael Hammond [00:42:11]: I know sugar tastes good. It tastes great, but it's not just there to make it taste good. It's also there to help shuttle those electrolytes where they need to go. An alternative, of course, is just, you know, eating eating healthy in general, eating healthy carb sources as a general part of your diet, and then taking those 0 sugar, electrolytes. But in general, that's why I'm gonna say that they're a little bit overrated, I think, because of that because of that and also because of the fact that, you know, electrolytes are in your food. I always I like to tell people that, you know, I think the the supplement industry and, again, I'm I'm a huge fan of supplements. I think they're awesome. I think electrolyte supplements are fantastic, but I do think the supplement industry has almost successfully convinced people that electrolytes that are like this this foreign thing that you have to get from expensive, you know, powders and stuff.

Michael Hammond [00:43:00]: These it's it's just sodium, which is in salt. Obviously, that's our our source of sodium. It's in it's potassium, you You know? Eat a banana. There you go. There's your potassium. It's calcium, which, you know, you get from all sorts of different sources. Right? So it's really it's pretty it's it's much more simple, I think, than those supplement companies make it out to be. So if you're eating healthy, salting your food, and I would tell any runner, salt the heck out of your food.

Michael Hammond [00:43:24]: You know? I I mean, I get it. Some people have hypertension and and health issues beyond a discussion like this. But for most people that are marathon training, yeah, salt the heck out of your food. It tastes great for a reason because your tongue is craving it. Your body's craving it. So, but anyway, I I do think that they're a little bit overrated just because of the push towards 0 sugar, especially when they start using alternatives that we just don't know a lot about. It's not that they're by default bad necessarily, but we just there's a lot of those are relatively new in the scope of human nutrition, so we just don't really know what's going on with them. We don't know whether they're good for us or not.

Michael Hammond [00:44:05]: So I think that they're a little bit overrated. I would recommend using one that either using one that has a little bit of sugar, or you could even add a little bit if you want. And I know I know there's such a huge movement to against sugar, and I'm I'm not necessarily saying sugar is a good thing for you. I'm just saying that the research is is extraordinarily clear that sugar glucose helps those electrolytes get where they need to go, helps your body keep those electrolytes instead of, you know if if you ever go on a carb, like, crash diet, you'll find that you lose all this weight because it's water weight. You're losing all this water weight because your body's not retaining any of that water, retaining not regular retaining those electrolytes. A lot of people who go super low carb will get, cramps, will get, like, I've I've gotten, like, Charlie horses before. Anybody who's gotten those, they're brutal. It's because your body cannot hang on to the the water and the electrolytes.

Michael Hammond [00:44:54]: The pumps are just all messed up. So, anyway, I think a little bit overrated, but electrolytes as a concept, not overrated at all. Super, super, super important. And and as I said, I find even when I'm eating perfectly healthy, salting the heck out of my food, eating right, I don't know, doing everything right, even then in the middle of summer, I gotta supplement electrolytes. It's just just gotta happen. I'm not a heavy sweater. So electrolytes are great. Electrolyte supplements, tad bit overrated.

Cory Nagler [00:45:21]: Yeah. I tend to agree, and I love the marketing around a lot of these things. I think a lot of people wanna avoid sugar and salt, but you take Gatorade and call it electrolytes and fuel, and suddenly everyone, wants to grab it at their first, opportunity. I also want your thoughts. Yeah.

Michael Hammond [00:45:35]: It's kinda yeah.

Cory Nagler [00:45:36]: Sorry. Go ahead.

Michael Hammond [00:45:36]: Oh, it's it's kinda like I I was gonna add, it's kinda similar to protein, and I think protein is great. You gotta you gotta have your protein. I'm I'm not saying that it's not important, and and I think that, yeah, I think it's a healthy part of even a runner's diet is having healthy protein. But whey protein, you know, it's come to the point where, like, you'll do this it'll be, like, 2, serving size, 2 mega scoops or whatever, and it'll be, like 50 grams of protein. I'm not saying that protein's bad for you. Protein's amazing for you. You gotta have it. But it's like they've successfully convinced people that you need this obscene amount of protein, this crazy insane amount of protein that is just not really it doesn't really make a lot of sense.

Michael Hammond [00:46:16]: This doesn't affect the running world quite as much, but definitely something you see more in the broader fitness space is like these obscene amounts of protein. I think that's because of the supplement industry, because because whey protein powder is cheap, lightweight, easily shippable, and thus it's very popular, very popular for them to make it, and it'll just be these absurd amounts of protein. So I think it's very similar with electrolytes in that it's it's it a lot of it is marketing, and yet, you know, there is a lot of this based in truth as well. So by no means am I saying that electrolytes are bad or even that the 0 Sugar ones are bad by default. They're not bad by default. I just think that it's important for people to know that that the glucose is an important part of that chain, of that process with electrolytes, of actually retaining that and having them go where they need to go to your to your muscles. So

Cory Nagler [00:47:06]: Yeah. I think there's a lot of parallels between the protein and the electrolytes. I I was gonna ask for your opinion. When I first started working with my coach or or the first summer after I started with working with her, I started looking around for electrolyte drinks because it's not something that I had used much in the past. And I found the majority of them had no calories, no sugar was their marketing. And I went to her and I asked and I said, what is the purpose of the target market here for people who need this obscene amount of salt but don't want any carbs or sugar? And and her response was that she said was the only thing she could think of was hot yoga. Is that accurate?

Michael Hammond [00:47:42]: Interesting. Was she do you think she was saying that just because they just, like, are in there sweating an obscene amount? Was that was that the idea?

Cory Nagler [00:47:49]: I think trying to think of somebody who would sweat an obscene amount without actually putting in much movement to burn calories because I think, as runners, we probably if you're sweating enough to need electrolytes, you're gonna need those carbs too.

Michael Hammond [00:48:00]: Dude, all I'm gonna say, I did yoga for the first time actually at one of our retreats. I got wrecked by the yoga teacher. Oh my goodness. I did it with the with the the people that were at the retreat. It was so hard. I had I I'm not a particularly flexible person. I had such a tough time, so I don't know that I can get behind that because yoga can be a huge challenge, man. It can be really hard, but but I see the point in terms of, like, you're not actually, like, I mean, I think yoga, you definitely do burn those calories, but I see the point that that would be the use case, someone who's not necessarily burning the calories but needs the electrolytes.

Michael Hammond [00:48:35]: I do think it's it's important to look at this stuff as a, in the grand scheme of things, in the scope of a full diet. And that's why I was saying, you know, those zero sugar electrolytes, they're not there's nothing wrong with them in the scope of a healthy diet. If you're eating good carb sources throughout the day, you know, and and and getting plenty of that glucose in, then, yeah, you don't necessarily need it directly with the supplement, which is which is why really that's my general attitude towards supplements. I love them, but I love them as supplements on top of an already healthy diet. They're gonna work better in that case. It just that's how they really are meant to work. They're not necessarily meant to be a direct replacement of and if if you take some take those, take electrolyte supplements, but you never eat any salt, like, you never actually salt your food, that's not good. Like, I I think you need to be getting that salt.

Michael Hammond [00:49:24]: Ideally, more, salt with extra with a a full mineral profile. I think that's important as well. But, yeah, I think that the there's probably not a good use case for that directly if you look at it kinda, you know, in vitro sort of by itself. It just taking an electrolyte supplement with no calories. But on top of a healthy diet, I could see where the 0 Sugar one could be a good alternative, especially for anybody who's who's who's diabetic or or prediabetic. I could see where, where it has a good use case if they feel like they're they have they're maxing out on carbs. The maybe their their doctor has them on, like, under a 100 grams a day or under whatever however many grams a day, and they don't wanna add any carbs from electrolytes, but they wanna take electrolytes. That's where I could see being a good use case for, the 0 Sugar one.

Michael Hammond [00:50:09]: So by no means am I tossing them out, you know, throwing them out the window. It's just I want people to understand the role of glucose, that it does have an important role to play in, electrolytes and electrolyte metabolism.

Cory Nagler [00:50:21]: Yeah. I'm with you 100%. Alright. Moving on to the next one. It's gonna be prehydrating, overrated or underrated. And when I say prehydrating, I'm not talking about your regular, you know, drinking water throughout the day. I'm talking about can you take in a lot of electrolytes and and fluids the day before and then hope that you can get away with a little bit less, the next day or later in the day?

Michael Hammond [00:50:43]: Oh, that's a good one. And it's funny. When I first read it, I'm gonna I'm gonna get some flack for this. When I first read it, I thought of I thought back to, like, my college days where before going out to, like, the bars or going to a party, you would pregame, which which which usually, you know, usually means, like, alcoholic consumption. But it's funny because something I've I still do this to this day. If I know I'm gonna have a like, on July 4th, I had you know, you have a few beers. I'm gonna make sure to to pre hydrate for for the event with with electrolytes and stuff. I I'm I'm not dealing with hangovers in my thirties, man.

Michael Hammond [00:51:15]: It's not happening. So, anyway, back to the topic at hand. I think that that's super overrated because I think that it's it's probably almost certainly foolish, and will probably lead to people doing really, really silly things. I mean, you know, taking in a ton of water, believe it or not I mean, most people I think most people know this can actually be dangerous. I mean, it it can actually be harmful to your body, which is why the electrolyte conversation is so important. To give people an idea, it's funny how, you know, usually the target in terms of your urine is to have it be clear. You actually want it to be a little bit less than clear. If it's super, super crystal clear, typically that means you don't you need a little bit extra salt.

Michael Hammond [00:51:57]: If it's super yellow, you know, the, or even or god forbid worse, you need to hydrate. You need water ASAP. Like, right now, right away, you need water. So, really, you actually want a little bit of color to your urine on a day to day basis. You don't necessarily wanna be peeing all the time and have it all be super super clear. So the point there being that it's actually possible to over hydrate, and I just don't think that there's I don't think that there's any any way that you're that anyone's gonna be able to do that. Even if it potentially has benefit, I think it would have to be under such a controlled environment that I don't think that that's even remotely worth it to to chase down. I would just hydrate normally as normally as possible, kind of similar to how I approach eating.

Michael Hammond [00:52:38]: I even am not a huge proponent of, like, crazy going insane with carbo loading before, before races because I think it's just so easy to have it get out of control. You know? It's it's a difficult thing without working with a professional, to really get right. So I think just have hydration have proper hydration become a habit for you, and and don't worry about playing the games of of excessive hydrating so that you have to drink less on race day. I would just hydrate totally normally going into a race or a workout.

Cory Nagler [00:53:09]: Does the same apply to when you're going out to drink? Do you need to drink normally, or would you still pregame with some water?

Michael Hammond [00:53:16]: Oh, that's good, man. No. Of course. Of course, you wanna yeah. You gotta pregame. Like I said, especially, you know, when I was 21 years old, I could probably get away with whatever I wanted, but I'm 34 now. You can't you can't do that. So, yeah.

Michael Hammond [00:53:26]: Definitely got a pregame. That's where electrolytes it's really funny to me that a lot of the electrolyte companies don't lean into that more. I've always found that really interesting that that there's not one of those brands that just said, you know what? We're gonna get away from, like, the fitness angle. We're just gonna go totally into hangover prevention and, you know, like, keeping you hydrated, whatever, as it pertains to alcohol. So I've always found that really funny that I I remember talking to a rep from one of the they're they're I would say they're not the big player now, but 10 years ago, they were the biggest name in electrolytes. And I remember him saying that they they re they knew full well that that was a big use case for the people that use their product was to was essentially hangover prevention because, hey, alcohol super quickly can deplete your electrolytes, your water as well, but but electrolytes are so important. That's what you can you can pound a bunch of water, but if you're not getting the electrolytes, that's, you know, that's not good either. So that's the best thing you can do actually to prevent a hangover is to have adequate match each alcoholic drink with 8 to 12 ounces of water with some electrolytes in it.

Michael Hammond [00:54:31]: You'll you'll feel great. No problem. I don't don't quote me on that because someone's gonna go absolutely insane with it and and end up in the hospital or something like that. But, in theory, if you do that accurately and you pre hydrate, then, yeah, you you're gonna do pretty well. But don't so do it with before you drink alcohol, pre hydrate, but don't do it before running, runs and races.

Cory Nagler [00:54:53]: We're not medical professionals on this show. That's for sure. But I do think the information that we're giving is practical, whether it's running or pregaming as it turns out.

Michael Hammond [00:55:02]: We are most certainly not medical professionals. I'm sure I would get scoffed at for a lot of the things that that I've said so far. And and this the especially the pre drinking one comes totally from personal experience. So, take it with a grain of salt, if I may. Take it with a grain of electrolyte. There you go.

Cory Nagler [00:55:19]: Good joke. Good joke. Alright. I know.

Michael Hammond [00:55:22]: Cut that cut that, Jeremy. Get that out of here.

Cory Nagler [00:55:25]: For those listening, Jeremy is our editor. So, well, I think I think we're gonna have to leave this one in. But for for our next topic, we actually kinda touched on this quickly, so I don't wanna harp on it too long. But calorie free sports drinks, any more thoughts on those?

Michael Hammond [00:55:37]: Oh, man. Super overrated. And and for the for the same effectively the same reason is that you're just getting the electrolytes. But, really, I would say on this topic, like, in terms of a sports drink, if we're talking about more of an energy thing, you know, keeping you energized throughout a run or a workout, yeah, I think it's I think it's extremely overrated to have it be calorie free. Now I'll balance that out by saying that I'm not a big proponent of fueling with any sort of, like, calories unless a run is minimum over an hour. My my rule typically for athletes, and this this is just default, and then we adjust based on the person. Anything under an hour, I think no question you shouldn't you shouldn't be getting any fuel. I think you should be fueling adequately on a day to day basis, you know, in terms of your meals, that that's not necessary.

Michael Hammond [00:56:23]: 60 to 90 minutes is subjective. Kinda depends on the type of workout. Maybe there are instances where it is necessary or depending on the person. And then 90 minutes plus, a lot of the time, yeah, but some fuel taken in unless you're do unless you're working on glycogen depletion as part of your strategy to for fat adaptation for the marathon, anything like that, but that's a that's kind of a more niche topic. But I would say that, yeah, I think the calorie free sports drinks on the whole, overrated for sure. Just I just don't see the the good use case for for runners. I think that the the no calorie electrolyte mixes can be a little bit different, but in terms of the calorie free sports drinks, I just don't see the, I don't see the benefit for runners, so definitely overrated.

Cory Nagler [00:57:06]: Yeah. I get that. Alright. I think that brings us to our last topic. And before I get into it, I need to give a little bit of background for anyone listening and for yourself to truly appreciate it. But in another overrated, underrated episode, when we had Rory on, and this was related to marathon topics, I think it was perhaps one of the most controversial answers that I talked about the post marathon beer, and his answer was that it's overrated. So, Michael, in the context of summer running, what is your response on a post run beer? Is it overrated or underrated?

Michael Hammond [00:57:39]: I'm gonna have to talk to Rory about that next week in Flagstaff that he said that was overrated. I'm I'm I'm flabbergasted that he said that it was overrated because he just seems like I mean, I know he I he loves running, and I know he loves beer. I can't believe he doesn't love the combo of both. It's like a food item where you like you like one ingredient, you like the other ingredient, but combining them, no thanks. I'm gonna say super underrated, man. I think a post run beer on a on, like, a warm, you know, warm, like, afternoon summer or little, like, evening summer run. This is why, like, pub runs are so popular. Warm evening afternoon or evening run followed by a cold beer.

Michael Hammond [00:58:15]: I mean, personally, for me, I think there's I think there's not about nothing better. It just feels so good. Is it again, it's one of those things I don't wanna sit here and claim that it's like this physiologically super healthy thing. I mean, I think there's there's an argument for glycogen, replenishment and stuff like that, but, ultimately, I'm not gonna sit here and try to argue that alcohol is good for you. However, I think it's super fun. I think it brings people together, and, yeah, I think it's extremely underrated, and I'm I'm gonna harass Rory about that in Flagstaff for sure because I can't believe that he said that.

Cory Nagler [00:58:49]: As you should, I can't think of anything better than a post marathon, you know, fuel than a than a good cold glass of beer.

Michael Hammond [00:58:58]: Watch. He's gonna say that he's actually playing a long joke, and he's gonna be like, no. The that's that's overrated because you should be having 2 beers after a a marathon. That's what he's gonna say. That he that's what he meant was only 1? Oh, that's super overrated. Why would you only do that? But no. I I really can't believe he said that. I'm I'm curious to hear his reasoning for that.

Cory Nagler [00:59:17]: Yeah. I hope that was his answer. We'll have to bring it back on the show if you do get a response from him as a follow-up.

Michael Hammond [00:59:23]: Yeah. Of course. Oh, I will. I will. I'll definitely see what he says. And if it's interesting, we'll we'll, we'll revisit.

Cory Nagler [00:59:29]: Alright. Tune in to the next overrated, underrated for a a full recap of what we think of here. But, Michael, I think that's a good place to end off. This was a lot of fun. Thank you so much for joining me again.

Michael Hammond [00:59:40]: You bet, Corey. It was a good time.

Cory Nagler [00:59:56]: Thanks for listening to the Run to the Top podcast. I'm the showrunner at Runners Connect, where as always, our mission is to help you become a better runner with every episode. You can connect with me on Instagram at Corey underscore Nagler. Birth your Strava by searching Corey Nagler. And please consider connecting with the rest of our team at runnersconnect.net. If you're loving the show, you can help us reach more runners by leaving a rating and consider subscribing to our newsletter by going to runnersconnect.netforward/podcast.

Michael Hammond [01:00:33]: I'll see

Cory Nagler [01:00:33]: you on the next show. But until then, happy running, everyone.